Need naturalization information for Santo Forte

Over 25 million Italians have emigrated between 1861 and 1960 with a migration boom between 1871 and 1915 when over 13,5 million emigrants left the country for European and overseas destinations.
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phil100a
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Need naturalization information for Santo Forte

Postby phil100a » 06 Aug 2008, 01:53

Hope everyone is well.

I'm about 2 months into document fathering for dual citizenship via jure sanguinis.

My GF, Santo Forte, emigrated to the US in 1907, at 36 years of age. He was from Caltanissetta, in Sicily. I've seen his name on Ellis Island manifests, and also on the 1930 US Census. In the latter, he's listed with a misspelling, as "Santoe Forte (sic), with the "e" added on his first name, in error. The census shows him as naturalized.

My father was born in the US, in 1911. I need to know if my GF naturalized before 1912, because of the obscure law that says if someone naturalized in 1912, all preceding children born in the US are automatically American citizens. If that was the case, I would not be able to pursue jure sanguinis status, and would have to pursue another approach to Italian citizenship.

I checked with the Monroe County (New York State) Court. They didn't have a record. I also checked what I think was a regional office of the national archives, near NYC (by phone). So far, no record.

I know that there are other avenues to search, including the INS (which takes forever).

If anyone has a way to find this information out, and tell me where to go to make it official (with a document), let me know. Or, if yuo're good at finding these things out, I'd sure like to know the answer to when he naturalized.

My GF didn't speak any English at all. There are times when I imagine he didn't naturalize, even though the census says he did. I know that sometimes census takers in those days didn't even ask for proof.

Thanks in advance for any help on this.

Cheers,
Phil

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PeterTimber
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Re: Need naturalization information for Santo Forte

Postby PeterTimber » 06 Aug 2008, 02:21

go to www.naturalizationrecords.com/usa It looks promising. =Peter=

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Re: Need naturalization information for Santo Forte

Postby wldspirit » 06 Aug 2008, 03:12

This may help in locating information on your grandfather, looks promising in theory:

naturalization request

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johnnyonthespot
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Re: Need naturalization information for Santo Forte

Postby johnnyonthespot » 10 Aug 2008, 11:14

Phil - did you have your grandfather's American death certificate? You'll need it for a jure sanguinis application, but I wanted to point out that the typical death certificate includes an item of the "Citizen of the US: Y/N" or "Citizen of: (fill in country)".

Although not absolutely correct (since the information was typically provided by a grieving loved one post-mortem), it's a good indicator as to the liklihood of naturalization.

Old state court records for Westchester County are held by the Westchester County Archives - which is exactly where I was able to locate my own grandfather's (both of them!) naturalization records. Does Monroe County have a similar office?

Actually, check this out, "Naturalization Registrar
Each month the County Clerk administers the Oath of Allegiance to new Citizens of the United States at a Naturalization Ceremony organized by the U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service. The County Clerk also maintains Naturalization records from 1821–present for Naturalizations which took place in Monroe County." I found that at http://www.monroecounty.gov/clerk-index.php

Wow! 1821 - Present! Looks like the place to go!

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Re: Need naturalization information for Santo Forte

Postby suanj » 10 Aug 2008, 13:09

seeming that the first destination of Santo was Rochester NY; also the wife and children ( Rosa and Calogero) in 1909 trip ( May 14, 1909 crossed) joining at Santo Forte in Rochester NY, and in the just ship's manifest of Jun 05, 1909 Concetta and children again as Rochester final destination;

1910 United States Federal Census
about Santi Forti
Name: Santi Forti
Age in 1910: 38
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1872
Birthplace: Italy
Relation to Head of House: Head
Father's Birth Place: Italy
Mother's Birth Place: Italy
Spouse's Name: Concettina
Home in 1910: Rochester Ward 16, Monroe, New York
Marital Status: Married
Race: White
Gender: Male
Year of Immigration: 1908
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Santi Forti 38
Concettina Forti 31
Rose Forti 8
Lillian Forti 6
Josephine Maggani 21
Michael Maggani 24
Paul Forti 42


in 1910 census Santo is registered as alien... so no paper applications... I believe he naturalized after some year....

in facts if this 1920 census is right, Santo was with Papers Application:
1920 United States Federal Census
about Santa Fort
Name: Santa Fort
[Santo Fort]
Home in 1920: Rochester Ward 7, Monroe, New York
Age: 44 years
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1876
Birthplace: Italy
Relation to Head of House: Head
Spouse's Name: Congtina
Father's Birth Place: Italy
Mother's Birth Place: Italy
Marital Status: Married
Race: White
Sex: Male
Home owned: Rent
Year of Immigration: 1907
Able to read: Yes
Able to Write: Yes
Image: 559
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Santa Fort 44
Congtina Fort 41
Frank Fort 10
Joe Fort 9
Mike Fort 7
Paul Fort 2 6/12
Sullivan Fort 16

so he naturalized after 1920...
and in 1930 he and italian members are naturalized:
1930 United States Federal Census
about Santoe Forte
Name: Santoe Forte
Home in 1930: Rochester, Monroe, New York
Age: 59
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1871
Birthplace: Italy
Relation to Head of House: Head
Spouse's Name: Constantine
Race: White
Occupation:

Education:

Military service:

Rent/home value:

Age at first marriage:

Parents' birthplace: View Image
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Santoe Forte 59
Constantine Forte 51
Lillian Forte 27
Frank Forte 19
Joseph Forte 18
Mick Forte 17
Paul Forte 12

strange.. in the ship's manifest of Santo, no markings abt naturalization....

regards, suanj
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Re: Need naturalization information for Santo Forte

Postby phil100a » 12 Aug 2008, 06:23

To everyone that answered: Grazie mille!! to everyone for your help.

Today, after having almost given up on my first request to Monroe County (I sent the letter several weeks ago), I just received what looks like confirmation that my GF first applied for naturalization in January of 1913, and was naturalized sometime after that. I have just begun to review the papers, and will know more, later.

Thus, it appears that I don't have to worry at all about the "1912 rule". That's very good news, indeed!

However, I have another question: I noticed that my GF's children's names (My father's name is among them) were on some of the "naturalization papers" that I have just begun to review.

Could my GF have "naturalized" his children, and if so, would there have to be a separate certificate for each child, or could they do "bulk" naturalizations, where the parent and children were naturalized all at once?

After a cursory look at the documents, I _don't think_ this is the case, but I will look closer tomorrow.

Is there any one thing i should look for in the documents that indicates my father was naturalized along with my GF? (this would, unfortunately, disqualify me from jure sanguinis possibility, so I hope it's _not_ the case).

Again, thanks in advance...

Phil

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phil100a
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Re: Need naturalization information for Santo Forte

Postby phil100a » 12 Aug 2008, 07:19

Quick addition to my note, above:

I just looked at the 1930 census; none of Santo Forte's children, except for one child (16 years old) were listed as "NA", (naturalized) so it looks like I may still be OK? My father and his brothers have nothing listed after their name - it's just "blank" ___) in the "naturalization column".

My GF's name is (mis)spelled "Santoe Forte" on the 1930 census, with his wife ("Constantine" - her real name was "Concetta") showing as naturalized.

This is very fascinating; it shows the imperfections of information gathering in those days. It's a very complex process.

Here's another question: I live in the San Francisco region, and the Italian Consulate is notoriously slow there. I may ask my siblings if they're interested in joining my petition for Italian citizenship.

Two siblings live in Rochester, and one lives in South Carolina.
Are either of the Italian consulates in their respective regions any faster at getting this done?

Or, is there _any_ way to get a consulate to move faster? It's troubling that some consulates can get this done in 5 months, and others take up to two years, not including the actual petition to Italy.


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