Looking for insight

Over 25 million Italians have emigrated between 1861 and 1960 with a migration boom between 1871 and 1915 when over 13,5 million emigrants left the country for European and overseas destinations.
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Asciano-bound
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Looking for insight

Postby Asciano-bound » 16 Sep 2008, 21:11

We have been working on our application for dual citizenship for some time. We have all documents/apostilles needed. We've got our appointment with the consulate (still a year away.)

The concern I have is that the only proof of Italian citizenship I can find is a certificate of US citizenship (not certificate of naturalization) for my wife's grandfather. The certificate is dated Sept 1, 1942 (long before my wife's mother's birth). The certificate states that my wife's grandfather "derived citizenship through the naturalization of his father (name of his father) on November 17, 1921, by the United States District Court at Brooklyn, NY, applicant being then a minor and having resided permanently in the United States since June 11, 1906."

I did an index search on USIS and this is the only document available to me. How will the consulate interpret this? I interpret it as my wife's grandfather did not apply for citizenship until 1942, citing his father's naturalization and his long residency in the US. But will the Italians view it the same? I'm concerned that they may interpret it as he being naturalized at the same time as his father (in 1921).

Any feedback would be appreciated.

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matta
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Re: Looking for insight

Postby matta » 16 Sep 2008, 22:07

Asciano-bound wrote:We have been working on our application for dual citizenship for some time. We have all documents/apostilles needed. We've got our appointment with the consulate (still a year away.)

The concern I have is that the only proof of Italian citizenship I can find is a certificate of US citizenship (not certificate of naturalization) for my wife's grandfather. The certificate is dated Sept 1, 1942 (long before my wife's mother's birth). The certificate states that my wife's grandfather "derived citizenship through the naturalization of his father (name of his father) on November 17, 1921, by the United States District Court at Brooklyn, NY, applicant being then a minor and having resided permanently in the United States since June 11, 1906."

I did an index search on USIS and this is the only document available to me. How will the consulate interpret this? I interpret it as my wife's grandfather did not apply for citizenship until 1942, citing his father's naturalization and his long residency in the US. But will the Italians view it the same? I'm concerned that they may interpret it as he being naturalized at the same time as his father (in 1921).

Any feedback would be appreciated.


It means that your wife's grandfather became a US citizen with his father in 1921. That's not an interpretation, that's actually what happened.

Assuming your wife's father (or mother) was born after November 17, 1921, you and your wife do not qualify for citizenship jure sanguinis through that line. However, you wife can regain citizenship via residency in Italy. She can apply after the second year but before the third year.

Sorry :(

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mler
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Re: Looking for insight

Postby mler » 17 Sep 2008, 13:18

Matta states it very clearly, but I'd like to emphasize that his is NOT an interpretation. Minors were frequently naturalized along with their parents, and, unfortunately, when the parent renounced Italian citizenship, he also renounced it on behalf of his child.

Your wife's grandfather naturalized in 1921, but because the naturalization certificate was issued in his father's name, he requested the certificate you mention to prove (not apply for) his U.S. citizenship.

The documents you have already obtained will go a long way to proving that your wife qualifies for citizenship through the 3-year residency route.

I'm sorry too.

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domenic5
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Re: Looking for insight

Postby domenic5 » 17 Sep 2008, 20:01

Hi,

You may need to contact the consulate for that problem. Some companies do consulate mediation but for a charge. or just go ahead and contact the consyulate yourself explaining the problem.

Good luck

Domenic

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matta
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Re: Looking for insight

Postby matta » 17 Sep 2008, 20:24

domenic5 wrote:Hi,

You may need to contact the consulate for that problem. Some companies do consulate mediation but for a charge. or just go ahead and contact the consyulate yourself explaining the problem.

Good luck

Domenic


There's no interpretation or decision being made here, based on the facts he mentioned, his grandfather naturalized in 1921. The only "mediation" that would help is to hire a lobbying firm to get the laws changed in Rome.

I hate it when someone doesn't qualify, especially when that person has invested time and effort into the process already. However, telling him to hire a lawyer or mediator for a case where he clearly won't qualify is irresponsible.

I would encourage him to talk to the consulate, but if someone naturalized in the US, even as a child, that line is broken unless that person's decedent is born before the date of naturalization.


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