Question requarding certificates

Over 25 million Italians have emigrated between 1861 and 1960 with a migration boom between 1871 and 1915 when over 13,5 million emigrants left the country for European and overseas destinations.
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Graziella_2134
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Question requarding certificates

Postby Graziella_2134 » 27 Sep 2009, 04:18

IS, "certificato di trascorso possesso della cittadinanza italiana" the same as Certificato storico di cittadanaza?

I found this site....

http://www.homeonline.it/

Where i could find send a request for the certificato storico di cittadanaza for my mom.

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jwazevedo
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Re: Question requarding certificates

Postby jwazevedo » 28 Sep 2009, 04:13

Can you tell us your purpose for this document?

If you're applying to recognize Italian citizenship through jus sanguinus, you can get proof of your mom's Italian heritage through the comune where she was born in Italy. Generally, the consulate asks for the birth certificate and the "certificato di trascorso..." as part of your application. When I went through the process, I sent the comune a request for these two documents for my grandfather and got them in the mail a few weeks later.

Best,
Jerry

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Graziella_2134
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Re: Question requarding certificates

Postby Graziella_2134 » 28 Sep 2009, 20:46

jwazevedo wrote:Can you tell us your purpose for this document?

If you're applying to recognize Italian citizenship through jus sanguinus, you can get proof of your mom's Italian heritage through the comune where she was born in Italy. Generally, the consulate asks for the birth certificate and the "certificato di trascorso..." as part of your application. When I went through the process, I sent the comune a request for these two documents for my grandfather and got them in the mail a few weeks later.

Best,
Jerry



Yup that is what i'm applying for...the recognition of italian citizenship through jus sanguinus.

I couldn't find anything on comune.it so i found that webside and i paid about 58.80 euro for a certificato storico di resdienza. Think i should cancel that order? I dont' even know where to look on that site....i tried to search but i didn't find anything for certificato di transcorso.

My mom became a Canadian citizenship in 1985-86 around that time...so i have a list of the documents i need to collect. because there are specific items that are needed for certain situations.

So for parents who became canadian citizens they are requesting these documents:

italian passports (valid or expired) or "certificato di trascorso possesso della cittadinanza italiana"

certificate of canadain citizenship (long form showing day, month and year) or "search Letter"

marriage certificate (issued by the italian city hall where marriage was registered) or Certified copy of registration of marriage" (long form )

certified copy of registration of death --- N/A

Because my father was born here all i need is a copy of his brith certificate.

I was thinking that they would need my mom's birth certificate but it doesnt mention on there...unless i'm following the wrong collect of documents....I don't know...it's all very confusing.


Did you do it through Toronto Italian consulate? by chance?

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Re: Question requarding certificates

Postby PeterTimber » 28 Sep 2009, 21:26

The Certificate of Citizenship is the document certifying the possession of Italian citizenship and is, therefore, issued only to citizens residing in Italy.
There is no certificato di cittadinanza italiana storico that I am aware exists. www.homeonline.it/doc.cfm/86/certificat ... ttadinanza

=Peter=
~Peter~

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Graziella_2134
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Re: Question requarding certificates

Postby Graziella_2134 » 28 Sep 2009, 22:10

PeterTimber wrote:The Certificate of Citizenship is the document certifying the possession of Italian citizenship and is, therefore, issued only to citizens residing in Italy.
There is no certificato di cittadinanza italiana storico that I am aware exists. www.homeonline.it/doc.cfm/86/certificat ... ttadinanza

=Peter=


this is the discrption that i have...


Il Certificato Storico di Residenza è un documento che riporta le informazioni relative alla residenza pregressa in un determinato comune di residenza storica.

and this is what i bought off of that site...I'm just not sure which doument i should get.. this one or the one you gave in the link. because both cost the same amount of money.


EDIT: I think i do have the wrong form though....

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Re: Question requarding certificates

Postby jwazevedo » 28 Sep 2009, 22:21

Hi Graziella,

I do remember the feeling of it being "very confusing". I started my process in March and just turned in my paperwork in August. Thanks to the generous advice of members of this forum, I was able to work through the procedure, and I'm sure you will be able to do that too.

Though I went through the Vancouver Consulate, I think the information sheet they provide is similar to yours in Toronto. At least, I too was mystified by this "transcorso" certificate. Thanks, Peter, for explaining what it is for and how it applies. In my naivete, I simply sent a letter to the comune where my grandfather was born and asked them for:
• Estratto integrale dell'Atto di Nascita di XXX
• Certificato di trascorso possesso della cittadinanza italiana di XXX

They sent me the birth certificate and a page certifying that my grandfather was an Italian citizen when he emigrated in 1907. Those documents became the start of my package for the consulate. Since it worked for me, I'd recommend you do that as well. You can also request the marriage certificate at the same time (if that's where they married).

I've never heard of that "certificato di cittadinanza italiana storico" either. I'm not sure what you ordered, but I doubt that you need it, and if you can cancel, best to do so and save your money. The documents you need are available from the comune for free.

Good luck!
Jerry

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Re: Question requarding certificates

Postby Graziella_2134 » 28 Sep 2009, 22:36

was it comuni.it?

Yeah i can cancel that order so I have done so. I'm going to follow your lead on that then, thanks so much.

Did your grandfather become a canadain citizien?

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Re: Question requarding certificates

Postby jwazevedo » 28 Sep 2009, 22:50

Do you know the comune where your mother was born? If so, you can find the address for the comune at: www.comuni-italiani.it/

My grandfather became an American citizen (but after my mother was born, thank goodness). So my document requirements were quite different from yours. The thinking is the same, though. You simply need to prove a continuous line of Italian citizenship from your ancestors to you, and the documents to do that are the various birth/marriage/naturalization/death records. It all makes sense when you think of it this way.

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Graziella_2134
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Re: Question requarding certificates

Postby Graziella_2134 » 28 Sep 2009, 23:19

Yeah, lol thank goodness is right or else you couldn't have claimed italian citizienship. That is my understanding anyhow.

Just curious how long did it take for them to process all your paper work and what not?


I do know the comuni and i would have never found that site..THANKS!! :D


I shall email them now. If you do put it that way it does make sense. thanks again.

EDIT: What do you put in the email? just your reason for questing the documents and my mom's name ect..?

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Re: Question requarding certificates

Postby jwazevedo » 29 Sep 2009, 00:39

I understand that email requests are hit and miss. A letter supposedly works a lot better. But you can try.

Here's what I wrote:

"Egregi Signori,

Mi chiamo XXX, ed abitare nel Canada all'indirizzo sopradetto. Cerco informazioni sul mio nonno, XXX, che nato nel comune di XXX il 14 luglio 1886. Cerco questi dati per ottenere la cittadinanza Italiana. Per quello scopo, il Consolato d’Italia a Vancouver mi ha chiesto di fornire due documenti. Vi sarei molto grato se poteste spedirmi:

• Estratto integrale dell'Atto di Nascita di XXX

• Certificato di trascorso possesso della cittadinanza italiana di XXX (data d’emigrazione circa 1904 per Stati Uniti)

Vi ringrazio in anticipo per la vostra gentilezza e premura, e vi prego di addebitarmi tutte le spese postali e dei certificati. Includo, in questa lettera, i tagliando di risposta internazionale che sono per i francobolli richiesti per la risposta.

Distinti saluti,"

They responded quickly and completely.

My paperwork hasn't been completely processed yet. The Consulate told me to expect it to take six months. We'll see.

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Graziella_2134
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Re: Question requarding certificates

Postby Graziella_2134 » 29 Sep 2009, 01:06

shoot...maybe i should try that email again....

six months huh? wow....okay well thank you it gives me a timeline to decided what i'm going to do.

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Re: Question requarding certificates

Postby jwazevedo » 29 Sep 2009, 01:29

Maybe I misunderstood your question. The comune got the documents to me in less than a month (others have waited longer, but a month is not unreasonable). It took me just over five months to get all of my documents together. Then I gave everything to the Consulate, and they told me it would be six months before I heard whether my citizenship was recognized.

Getting the documents together was an interesting process, and along the way I learned much about my family history, which I feel is as much the point as the end goal of citizenship. Enjoy the ride.

Jerry

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Re: Question requarding certificates

Postby Graziella_2134 » 01 Oct 2009, 02:00

No it's okay...I just didn't put in the last post everything i should have. But I understood what you meant though. ^_^

thanks

EDIT: did you also provide stamps to mail the documents too you?

I can't seem to find the mailing address for the comune i want to communicate with....all i can find is the mailing address for the postale italiano..which i don't think is the place i should send the letter.


any help with this part of the process?

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Re: Question requarding certificates

Postby jwazevedo » 01 Oct 2009, 03:21

I sent them an International Reply Coupon, which supposedly can be used around the world in lieu of local stamps. They just sent it right back to me. (I have it as a souvenir now.) Next time I won't do that, but I will ask if they require any money for the stamps. Most comuni just send it with their own stamps. Be sure to enclose a large self-addressed envelope, though. That can speed things along.

I don't know which comune you're dealing with, but you can use this general form for the address:

Comune di [COMUNE NAME]
Ufficio dello Stato Civile
[CAP#] - [COMUNE NAME] [PROVINCE CODE]
ITALIA / ITALY

You can get the CAP# and the province code from the "comuni" website I gave you earlier.

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teddi
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Re: Question requarding certificates

Postby teddi » 02 Oct 2009, 06:08

Go to www.comuni.it and type the comune name in the "Cercha il comune" box.


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