Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Over 25 million Italians have emigrated between 1861 and 1960 with a migration boom between 1871 and 1915 when over 13,5 million emigrants left the country for European and overseas destinations.
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Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Postby DeFilippis78 » 10 Jan 2010, 19:04

Ive been told that its american tradition for a woman to take the husbands last name. So when people were immigrating here, on the ship they were listed by their maiden name, not married name. I noticed with one of my relatives that she came over with her married name, so obviously it happens sometimes. But in general, should I always be looking for the woman under her maiden name?

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Re: Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Postby johnnyonthespot » 10 Jan 2010, 19:09

DeFilippis78 wrote:Ive been told that its american tradition for a woman to take the husbands last name. So when people were immigrating here, on the ship they were listed by their maiden name, not married name. I noticed with one of my relatives that she came over with her married name, so obviously it happens sometimes. But in general, should I always be looking for the woman under her maiden name?

Alicia


Yes. Italian women keep their maiden name for life - at least, in the legal sense. Their passports, driver's licenses, and all legal documents are always in their maiden name. When they appear on passenger lists, it with their maiden name. If they are travelling with their children, you will see them listed as:

Code: Select all
  Smith, Mary
  Son Jones, Tom
  Son Jones, John
  Daughter Jones, Jane
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Re: Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Postby DeFilippis78 » 10 Jan 2010, 19:17

I guess my grandmother didnt stick with the norm. She used her married name on the ship and then through out her life here on everything. Maybe she just really wanted to assimilate.

I think as far as her using married name on the ship was because my grandfather was here several years before her. He might of told her the american tradition and told her to start using his name right away because thats how things would be anyway.

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Re: Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Postby johnnyonthespot » 10 Jan 2010, 19:50

DeFilippis78 wrote:I guess my grandmother didnt stick with the norm. She used her married name on the ship and then through out her life here on everything. Maybe she just really wanted to assimilate.


Sure. Once in the US, a married woman would be expected to follow the US style.

I think as far as her using married name on the ship was because my grandfather was here several years before her. He might of told her the american tradition and told her to start using his name right away because thats how things would be anyway.

Alicia


This one concerns me. Are you absoultely, positively, positive that you have the correct travel record for your grandmother? Keep in mind that she would have had to present her passport in order to get on the ship (and into the US) - and her passport would have had her maiden name on it. It would have been quite difficult for her to travel under her husband's name, so far as I know.
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Re: Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Postby pink67 » 10 Jan 2010, 19:54

To tell the truth I saw early immigration records (prior to 1900) were women were listed with their husbands under their husband's last name...
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Re: Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Postby PeterTimber » 10 Jan 2010, 19:58

Ships manifests were prepared by shipping agents for the steamship company passengers were to embark upon. The majority of the steamship companies were either English or German flagships. English agents were used to married women bearing their husbands surnames and even though passports were normally presented expeditous entries may have precluded use of the wive's maiden names. It was a chance thing without rule or reason. =Peter=
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Re: Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Postby DeFilippis78 » 10 Jan 2010, 20:01

Im absolutely positive I have the right people and manifest. Actually i just double checked it. They didnt put the married name or maiden name! It says her name is Adelina and then put "wife".

I dont know how to post a link but if you want to take a peek at the manifest its May 31, 1911 the Ancona. Its Giuseppe De Filippis and Adelina. Her maiden name is Lazzaro but they didnt use either name. Ellis island has her listed as Adelina De Filippis on their records but thats probably because they dont know her maiden name

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Re: Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Postby johnnyonthespot » 10 Jan 2010, 20:04

DeFilippis78 wrote:Im absolutely positive I have the right people and manifest. Actually i just double checked it. They didnt put the married name or maiden name! It says her name is Adelina and then put "wife".


Ah, that is a different story. I thought we were talking about a married woman traveling separately from her husband. For example, regards both my maternal and paternal grandparents, the men came over first and the women and children who were born in Italy came over at a later date. They were listed on the manifests as per my example above.
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Re: Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Postby DeFilippis78 » 10 Jan 2010, 20:11

Oh I see. So if they are together its ok but if seperate they use the maiden name?

Im only asking because the thorn in my side of not being able to find a great great grandmothers manifest. Maiden or married name...nothing. So I was just trying to clarify the rules a little.

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Re: Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Postby johnnyonthespot » 10 Jan 2010, 20:23

DeFilippis78 wrote:Oh I see. So if they are together its ok but if seperate they use the maiden name?

Im only asking because the thorn in my side of not being able to find a great great grandmothers manifest. Maiden or married name...nothing. So I was just trying to clarify the rules a little.

Alicia


As in your own example, when traveling with their husband, the wife usually seems to not have a surname at all. She is simply "wife", like this:

Code: Select all
  Jones, Peter
  Wife  Mary
  Son Tom
  Son John
  Daughter Jane


What information do you have for your great-great-grandmother?
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Re: Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Postby PeterTimber » 10 Jan 2010, 20:30

I checked out the May 30, 1911 sailing for the Ancona departing Genova, Napoli and Palermo and it only had 47 passengers listed and none were De Fillipis that I could see? (ellisisland ship arrivals 1911) =Peter=
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Re: Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Postby vj » 10 Jan 2010, 20:30

DeFilippis78 wrote:Im absolutely positive I have the right people and manifest. Actually i just double checked it. They didnt put the married name or maiden name! It says her name is Adelina and then put "wife".

I dont know how to post a link but if you want to take a peek at the manifest its May 31, 1911 the Ancona. Its Giuseppe De Filippis and Adelina. Her maiden name is Lazzaro but they didnt use either name. Ellis island has her listed as Adelina De Filippis on their records but thats probably because they dont know her maiden name
Alicia


johnnyonthespot wrote:... What information do you have for your great-great-grandmother?...


Hi Carmine & all!
This may help
Valarie

This post:
http://italiangenealogy.tardio.com/Foru ... art=0.html

This manifest:
According to his 1911 manifest, Giuseppe De Filippis was in the US from 1905 (or 1908) to 1910 in Hoboken
Have you found his other manifest(s)
They may have notations made later by naturalization officials
(Adelina has notations dated 9 Sep 1941)

1911 manifest
page 2
---

helpful guide to naturalization markings
http://www.jewishgen.org/infofiles/manifests/occ/
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Re: Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Postby DeFilippis78 » 10 Jan 2010, 20:31

Her name is Josephine Cimarelli. Passaro That is supposedly her maiden name according to her sons social application. She marreid Ben Passaro. I have a manifest for him but he is by himself. I cant find her in any way shape or form...tried all different spellings, different forms of Josephine in Italian, etc. She was supposedly born around 1875. According to her 1910, 1920, and 1930 census there is a 10 year discrepancy in age and year of immigration. Ive seen 1893 all the way up to 1904. And then then 10 years difference in age. :? Im starting to wonder if her maiden name is slightly different. So Ive requested a social app. from another child of hers and a death certificate to see if everything matches up or she does in fact have a different maiden name.

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Re: Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Postby DeFilippis78 » 10 Jan 2010, 20:34

Valarie, I think he was asking about the grandmother i CANT find. Sorry to confuse you guys :oops:

Peter, on Ellis Island they have May 31st 1911, not 30th. It is definitely the Ancona from Napoli. There has to be a space between the DE and FILIPPIS or nothing shows.

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Re: Did a woman always use her maiden name on a manifest?

Postby DeFilippis78 » 10 Jan 2010, 20:40

Actually, I jus double checked. If you search through the ships on ellis island they are not there. If you search through passenger, Adelina De Filippis, she is there. Same ship same year, but you cant find her under a ship search, only passenger search.I dont get it

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