Italian Citizenship stops here

Over 25 million Italians have emigrated between 1861 and 1960 with a migration boom between 1871 and 1915 when over 13,5 million emigrants left the country for European and overseas destinations.
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jtres
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Italian Citizenship stops here

Postby jtres » 06 Mar 2010, 22:08

deletion.

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mler
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Re: Italian Citizenship stops here

Postby mler » 07 Mar 2010, 02:11

Instead, why not consider an alternative. You say you want to go back to Italy to work there. Why not simply go, set up residency with a pds in attesa di cittadinanza and apply at your comune. Your comune is aware of the bc problem and will not make it an issue. Since you have everything else, this may not be difficult.

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corrado
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Re: Italian Citizenship stops here

Postby corrado » 07 Mar 2010, 03:49

Please don't get so upset! I know this is terriable. I have another sugguestion. The provencial capital has copies of all the documents that should have been in the comune, please try that route before you give up!

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johnnyonthespot
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Re: Italian Citizenship stops here

Postby johnnyonthespot » 07 Mar 2010, 11:23

In these situations, are the comuni willing to re-create a lost/destroyed birth record based on evidence such as baptismal records?

It would seem to me that that would be a way around this problem. You may require legal help to force the issue.
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DeFilippis78
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Re: Italian Citizenship stops here

Postby DeFilippis78 » 07 Mar 2010, 17:04

I know its a longer route and the last alternative, but you can always go live and work there anyhow and after several years become a citizen due to permanent residency. Its a total last resort though.


Alicia

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mler
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Re: Italian Citizenship stops here

Postby mler » 07 Mar 2010, 17:27

Johnnyonthespot, thank you for the googleearth suggestion. Tried it; love it!

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Re: Italian Citizenship stops here

Postby johnnyonthespot » 07 Mar 2010, 18:21

mler wrote:Johnnyonthespot, thank you for the googleearth suggestion. Tried it; love it!


You'll love it even more once you have had some time to really discover what you can do with it.

Into astrology/astronomy? Click View -> Explore -> Sky.

Try the Flight SImulator mode: Tools -> Enter Flight Simulator

And, for something really cool, take a tour! In the Search pane (left side of screen), click the Directions tab and enter From and To locations, "Rome, Italy" to "Venice, Italy" for example. Hit the Search Icon (the magnifying glass), then click the "Play Tour" button - it's the one below the search box with three blue diamonds on it. Tools -> Options -> Touring will let you set things like speed and camera angle defaults.
Carmine

My hobby is finding things. Having found most of my own, I am happy to help others find theirs. PM me! :)

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PeterTimber
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Re: Italian Citizenship stops here

Postby PeterTimber » 07 Mar 2010, 18:37

What about Land Title records for your family inthe Comune?? Were they destroyed as well? =Peter=
~Peter~

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Re: Italian Citizenship stops here

Postby Donald66 » 07 Mar 2010, 22:37

jtres wrote:I had everything certified, amended (the death certificate of my grandfather which was off one year of his birth), apostilled, but because I didn't have the birth certificates of my greatgrandfather from the comune, ( I had baptismal certificates directly from the church, stamped and certified) they refused it. I even had a certified letter from the comune saying all the certificates before the 1940s were destroyed in the events of WWII. I find it an absolute shame as I have 100% italian blood, and I speak both fluent grammatical italian and dialect. I wanted to go back to work there, but now I really want nothing at all to do with the country, the bureaucracy denied a full blooded fluent speaker over the fact that he had baptismal certified documents when the birth certificates were all destroyed? Typical of Italian government though. I hate to sound so negative but if you guys were in my position , and denied your own birthright, you would feel negative too.


Did you go through the NY Consulate? Hopefully, we wont have the same problem as we got a similar "records lost" response for my grandfather. We do, however, have his Italian passport from 1894, so hopefully this will be of assistance.

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DeFilippis78
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Re: Italian Citizenship stops here

Postby DeFilippis78 » 08 Mar 2010, 00:14

Im curious as to what consulate your using.

Alicia

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jtres
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Re: Italian Citizenship stops here

Postby jtres » 08 Mar 2010, 07:22

First off thank you all for the kind words and encouragement. I really admire such gentle consideration. I did go straight through the New York consulate, but quite frankly I want nothing to do with Italy anymore. At my university I raised 20,000 dollars in support for the Abruzzo earthquake, and I also sent the money over there with the help of some people from the New York Consulate, who knew all about my situation and said "Oh just get the baptismal certificates you'll be fine". You must understand that when you do something for your homeland, you speak the language fluently, you frequently go back, and you have all the necessary substantial evidence and then get denied, it creates a deep seeded hatred for the bureaucracy. I will love my people and tradition forever, but as for the government absolutely not. Many Italians know it themselves. I contacted an attorney in Italy and it is possible to fight this case, and it is probable that I would come out of the whole deal with citizenship. But it defeats my purpose for citizenship (work and gaining money) when from the start I would be down about 10,000 euro in LEGAL fees not to mention costs for identification cards (license, ID) and passports.

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Re: Italian Citizenship stops here

Postby elba » 08 Mar 2010, 12:06

This case begs the question 'Who decides who is eligible for citizenship'?

In my mind the role of the consulate is being satisfied that all the relevant documentation is all in place and ready to send to Comune in Italy to make a decision to register you. This was clearly completed in this case and the final 'stumbling block' was effectively removed with the communication (letter) from the commune themselves.

That indicates clearly that if a petition were presented, personally, to them with is info, and their letter, there would be no problem. So do that and avoid the consulate whichever one it is (and I guessed it WAS NY) - for me, I will also bet that it will be easier than you think .

BUT - you have to be here in Italy to do it!
If you think education is expensive - try ignorance!
"Gente di Mare Genealogy"

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DeFilippis78
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Re: Italian Citizenship stops here

Postby DeFilippis78 » 08 Mar 2010, 17:25

Does anybody have any speculation as to why this could happen? Are we truly all at the mercy of whoever is sitting behind the desk at the consulate? It seems instead of the paperwork mattering its the person who your working with who decides if its going to happen or not.

Alicia

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elba
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Re: Italian Citizenship stops here

Postby elba » 08 Mar 2010, 18:28

DeFilippis78 wrote:Does anybody have any speculation as to why this could happen? Are we truly all at the mercy of whoever is sitting behind the desk at the consulate? It seems instead of the paperwork mattering its the person who your working with who decides if its going to happen or not.

Alicia


I fear that this is exactly the situation that many find themselves in when dealing with 'certain' consulates and 'certain' officials....

It really is a disgrace - but what can be done? I don't know'
If you think education is expensive - try ignorance!

"Gente di Mare Genealogy"

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DeFilippis78
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Re: Italian Citizenship stops here

Postby DeFilippis78 » 08 Mar 2010, 18:30

The theory will have to be then "Gods will be done", if its meant to happen, it will happen.

Alicia


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