NY and NJ - warning

Over 25 million Italians have emigrated between 1861 and 1960 with a migration boom between 1871 and 1915 when over 13,5 million emigrants left the country for European and overseas destinations.
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bmilazzo
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NY and NJ - warning

Postby bmilazzo » 15 May 2010, 14:06

Both

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DeFilippis78
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Re: NY and NJ - warning

Postby DeFilippis78 » 16 May 2010, 01:11

I sat on hold with vital records for an hour the other day. I was so furious I hung up. Its not the first time its happened. When I actually get some one on the phone they are quite nasty!

Alicia

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Re: NY and NJ - warning

Postby lilbees » 16 May 2010, 13:58

To add to this warning: When a search is requested they will only seearch the county you put on your request. They wil not search the entire state. The worst part is you have to pay county by county. Not cheap!

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Re: NY and NJ - warning

Postby jacobarber » 17 May 2010, 00:10

I need my great grandfather's death certificate from NYS. The state's Department of Health website says only a spouse, child, or parent can get a death cert unless you have a rightful and lawful claim, medical claim, or court order. I thought those requirements were causing the trouble with NYS documents. In other words, I still cannot walk in and request a certified copy of my great grandfather's death cert without matching their requirements.

Or are you telling me there's an easier way now?

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Re: NY and NJ - warning

Postby bmilazzo » 17 May 2010, 00:51

the

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Re: NY and NJ - warning

Postby jacobarber » 17 May 2010, 13:20

I threw you a PM. If this really makes my life easier, I'll be very grateful

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Re: NY and NJ - warning

Postby MST995 » 17 May 2010, 14:39

So, just to be clear, I live in the state of NY and everything in my family history (besides my great grand parents births in Italy) has happened in NY State outside of the five NYC counties (all marriages births and deaths).
So can I just go to http://www.health.state.ny.us/vital_rec ... quests.htm and fill out a application for each of the records I need, send them a check for the total and be done with it? Also, You mentioned that they won't give me any problems with requesting the documents for my grand parents and great grand parents, correct? Can I then send everything all at once to the NY secretary of state (http://www.dos.state.ny.us/corps/apostille.html) and have them do the apostilles for all of them?
Thanks in advance! Just want to get this right the first time!

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Re: NY and NJ - warning

Postby bmilazzo » 17 May 2010, 15:02

Yes,

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Re: NY and NJ - warning

Postby johnnyonthespot » 17 May 2010, 15:02

The New York state website will actually point you to the VitalChek service ( http://www.vitalchek.com/ ) for online orders or a printable form for mail-in orders.

New York has been very difficult in the past regarding releasing documents; I had to fight for nearly a year to get my grandfather's death certificate and even then ... well, I won't tell you how I finally did so.

Please do come back and let us know how you make out.

As for the apostilles, yes, you can bundle all your certificates together or send them separately (might be safer - worst case, you only lose one in the mail instead of all of them); the cost will be the same either way except for postage, of course. See http://www.dos.state.ny.us/corps/apostille.html
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Re: NY and NJ - warning

Postby hollyolly7 » 27 May 2010, 17:13

Vital check you should actually not use, unless they have changed and are doing long form certificates now--that's what you need to show to the consulate.

I also had to get my GGF's death certificate--I asked my dad if he could photocopy his license and sign it, then I think I also sent a copy of his birth certificate. If the person would be over 100 years old or so, I think they don't give you a hard time. Good luck

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Re: NY and NJ - warning

Postby johnnyonthespot » 27 May 2010, 17:17

hollyolly7 wrote:...
If the person would be over 100 years old or so, I think they don't give you a hard time. Good luck


My grandfather was born in 1886 and died in 1945. Nevertheless, I fought with New York for many, many, months before finally finding a workaround.
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Re: NY and NJ - warning

Postby jacobarber » 07 Jun 2010, 15:49

I think this needs some clarification.

The process to get marriage, divorce, etc. certs has been made much easier. Fill out a few forms, send your money in with proper ID and you're good to go.

Birth certificates, on the other hand, are turning out to be a giant hassle still. The NYS DOH website states that unless your name is on the certificate, you need a court order. The Genealogy dept of Vital Records verified this for me.

I just took a ride down to the local Supreme Court Clerk's office and asked about this process. Neither of the people there knew the exact necessary forms required for me to get my grandparents' birth certs, so they gave me a Request for Judicial Intervention form and an Index # form. The RJI will cost me $95 and the Index # will cost $210. On top of this, I think I'll need one for each of my grandparents, hiking the cost to a possible $610. Before handing them in, I have to come up with another form that explains the action that I'm taking by either writing my own form or finding one in the Law Library.

The one thing I'd like to find out is if the Executor of the Estate has any power to avoid this labyrinth of forms.

So if anyone does have a better way to get through this, laws that can be used to ease the pain, or anything at all that'll reduce the number of steps, please tell us.

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Re: NY and NJ - warning

Postby kontessa » 07 Jun 2010, 18:51

I am not an attorney. I don't think that you will need more than one court order. You are filing a petition against the NYS Department of Health, and seeking a judgement under Article 78 of the Civil Practice Law and Rules to compel issuance of certified birth, death and/or marriage certificates. You should include any and all records that you need in that one court order.

I also believe that if you have a living relative with power of attorney, or they are an executor to a deceased family member's estate/will then this person may be able to obtain the records for you.

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Re: NY and NJ - warning

Postby jacobarber » 07 Jun 2010, 19:29

$305 for 2 documents still seems a lot to me. I have no idea why they are so crazy about birth certificates.

I just got off the phone with a lady in the Certification dept at the Vital Stats office, and she told me that even the executor of the estate will have to get a court order. This is ridiculous. I am on my way to having everything ready, and 2 birth certificates are going to end up holding me back for longer than I want ... just because of New York State. Lame.

quick update
I was trying to find discussions of this same issue in other Italian genealogy related forums, and was lucky enough to run across this: http://www.ehow.com/how_5503599_obtain- ... -york.html

I feel a bit silly because I really should have found it sooner. It mentions the Request for Judicial Intervention form I mentioned earlier, but leaves out the Index # form and provides much better picture of the whole process. This reduces the price of the court order down to $95, which is much more reasonable than $305. I'm going to be pursuing this path soon, so I will post my experience with the process.

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Re: NY and NJ - warning

Postby MST995 » 08 Jun 2010, 14:41

My grandfather (non italian bloodline) is the only one that is dead and so are his parents. Would his wife (my italian grandmother) be able to request it?.. if not, I might just take the copy i have to the consulate when I go and hope that they don't give me any problems. He isn't even in the bloodline so they might not even ask for it. I don't think going through any kind of court order business is really worth it, after all I'm only doing this for fun. :)


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