Incorrect birth date on Birth Certificate Question

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Incorrect birth date on Birth Certificate Question

Postby typilgy » 06 Jun 2014, 02:40

Hi All,

I have my appointment all set up via New York City (unfortunately it is not until June 2015).

I currently am in procession of all documents needed but there is one issue with them, the birth date is different on the BC from the rest of her documents.

Literally all of her paperwork indicates September 24th, 1910 including her US death certificate and USCIS forms. On her birth certificate it says October 22, 1910. I know that these are all the correct documents as they are all originals.

Now what happens? Is this a large and expensive problem to fix?

Thank you in advanced.
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Re: Incorrect birth date on Birth Certificate Question

Postby Italysearcher » 06 Jun 2014, 09:31

You don't specify if the birth certificate is Italian or USA.
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Re: Incorrect birth date on Birth Certificate Question

Postby johnnyonthespot » 06 Jun 2014, 13:58

Thankfully, you have plenty of time to resolve this issue.

Assuming that you are referring to an Italian birth record, do you know with certainty that the other names listed (parents of the child) are correct? Do you know with certainty that the birthplace is correct?

It is possible that you simply have the wrong birth record. Many small comuni were overrun with a small number of surnames and it would not have been unusual for more than one child named "John Smith" to be born in a given year. And even more so in larger places like Naples or Rome.
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Re: Incorrect birth date on Birth Certificate Question

Postby juliakellun » 07 Jun 2014, 22:03

Check the records again and contact the authorities for the same. You have enough time to resolve this issue. You must aware the authorities about this issue.
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Re: Incorrect birth date on Birth Certificate Question

Postby typilgy » 09 Jun 2014, 07:37

Hey guys,

It is the correct record, all the documents are originals that were passed on to me.

I'm assuming I'll have to get a positivo/negativo?
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Re: Incorrect birth date on Birth Certificate Question

Postby johnnyonthespot » 09 Jun 2014, 17:05

typilgy wrote:Hey guys,

It is the correct record, all the documents are originals that were passed on to me.

I'm assuming I'll have to get a positivo/negativo?


Originals, as in the birth certificate you have is 104 years old and has always been in your family's records?

If not, then it is still possible that the record you have is the wrong one. Anyone who has been doing genealogical research for more than a short while has learned that family lore is wrong as often as it is correct; perhaps even more so. And, never, ever, trust another person's research. Ancestry.com is overrun with "Family Trees" which are fraught with errors made by inexperienced researchers.

Yes, you will need something to convince your consulate that the birth record in hand is the correct one. The positivo/negativo letter may or may not be sufficient.
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Re: Incorrect birth date on Birth Certificate Question

Postby typilgy » 10 Jun 2014, 22:50

Correct as in its that old haha.

The parents names are also listed correctly.
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Re: Incorrect birth date on Birth Certificate Question

Postby johnnyonthespot » 11 Jun 2014, 00:53

typilgy wrote:Correct as in its that old haha.

The parents names are also listed correctly.


Then you may have a problem.

Look at it from the consulate's point of view: just because you say I know this is the correct person because my family told me so and we've had this birth record like forever and the names are those that I always heard were the names of my ancestors... doesn't mean anything to the consulate. You and your family bible could simply be wrong.

From everything I have read on other boards, NYC can be very difficult over things like this.

So, once again, since you have plenty of time, you should consider your options. The best, by far, would be to try to get the US documents changed to match the Italian document (which you will NEVER be able to change). This may or may not be possible, depending on the state where the events took place and other factors. However, I would not change ANY of them until I knew that I would be permitted to change ALL of them.

OTOH, if these documents relate to a person not in your direct line (such as a grandmother when your path is self-father-grandfather) then you could always hope that the consulate will not actually take those documents at all. When I applied in NYC in 2008, all documents from both sides were a stated requirement however they actually only took the direct line documents - which was great for me because my mother's NYS birth certificate had a lot of problems.

I am sending you a PM also.
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Re: Incorrect birth date on Birth Certificate Question

Postby carubia » 11 Jun 2014, 07:11

Normally, the only documents from the US that you would need that would have your ancestor's date of birth are the death cert and petition for naturalization. The former can usually be amended, but definitely not the latter. If this person is in your "line," then you'll need the USCIS documents. Sometimes you can get away with just showing the certificate of naturalization without the petition, and if the certificate doesn't have the date of birth (just the age), you could fix this problem just by amending the death cert. However, recently the NY consulate asked for the petition even when the applicant has an original cert of naturalization, so that might not work.

To actually resolve this discrepancy with the petition, you could try first getting a "positivo/negativo" (I wish we had a better term for it). Another option would be to try to get a letter from USCIS stating that they think he is the same person as on the Italian birth cert. (This is very difficult to do, but I saw a case where someone managed to get it.) The third option is to get a court order declaring that the person on the petition and all the other docs is the same as the person on the birth cert. If you do the 3rd option you won't have to worry about amending the death cert.

NY has been increasingly likely to ask for court orders, so you may end up having to do that anyway, but I wouldn't do it before the appointment unless there were other more serious discrepancies (such as a surname problem) that needed to be addressed.

The other option, of course, is to establish residency in a place covered by a more reasonable consulate.

Actually, the first thing to do, before you do any of this, is to try to view the original record yourself to see if the date of birth is correct on the birth cert or if the stato civile clerk just made a mistake when preparing the birth cert.
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Re: Incorrect birth date on Birth Certificate Question

Postby johnnyonthespot » 11 Jun 2014, 13:57

PS: As a rule, the documents you submit with your application will be retained by the consulate forever. The only document normally photocopied and then returned to you is an original Certificate of Citizenship.

Also, most of the documents originating from the US will require apostilles. Nearly all states set limits on the age of a document which can be apostilled - Google "secretary of state connecticut" (new york, nevada, etc) and then search that page for "apostille" to learn the requirements. Apostilles must be obtained from the state which originally issued the document, not your current state of residence.

All things considered, you may want to go ahead and obtain new copies of any documents which are particularly old or have sentimental value.

PPS: In your original post you said, "On her birth certificate it says October 22, 1910."

What type of document is this? It is at least possible that you are reading it incorrectly and that the October 22, 1910 date is the date the birth was recorded as opposed to the actual date of birth. This is a common error when deciphering "atti di nascita" records. Granted, the discrepancy between recorded date and birthdate is usually more along the lines of a day or two, but longer periods are not unheard of.
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