name changes

Over 25 million Italians have emigrated between 1861 and 1960 with a migration boom between 1871 and 1915 when over 13,5 million emigrants left the country for European and overseas destinations.
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ar928
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name changes

Postby ar928 » 10 Jul 2006, 12:57

Sorry, I tried searching for this but I could not find anything that was related to my problem.

I'll start off with saying that I am American in it's truest form, as I am 100% sure of at least 6 different ethnicities (including Italian) that are a part of my DNA (English, French, German, Dutch, Irish, Italian).

Anyway, seeing as how I am so watered down, yet still retain a very dark complexion and hairy arms/legs ;), makes me want to find out more of my Italian (fathers, who's half by his father) side.

Basically, from the story that I learned from my dad and grandfather, I believe my grandfather's great-grandfather came to NY from Italy....probably in that big boom of tthe late 1800s. I think anyway....even if I have the greats messed up it doesn't really matter (my grandfather passed away this year...he was born in 1929, so I guess the theory of his grandfather coming makes sense.)

Anyway, my last name is Rich, which obviously is not a very Italian name, and people are usually surprised when I tell them. The story, as I understood it, was that when my ancestors first came to the US, they immediately changed their last name to rich, and possibly even their first names as well, to appear more American since there was some discrimination back then.

The problem, however, is that no one knows for sure what the original surname was. So my main question: is it possible that they could have been entered in the Ellis Island database with the surname of Rich, as opposed to their original? Also what are some possibly Italian names that would be switched to Rich? Ricco usually comes up as the most probable.

I'm sorry I don't have more information, I am currently trying to find some sort of record that at least gives my 3xgreat grandfather's name, be it the Americanized or original.

I do know however that my grandfather's mother's surname was Porto, and met her brother (my grandfather's uncle), at his funeral, which was a pretty cool experience (his skin was extremely dark eheh) so I may just research through that tree.

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Re: name changes

Postby suanj » 10 Jul 2006, 14:35

for to better help you, please you write here also the first name, probable birthyear, where he lived, spouse name etc.. regards, suanj
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Re: name changes

Postby mler » 10 Jul 2006, 19:12

I'm thinking Ricci--for which a close pronunciation is RICH EE. (really REECH EE)

The close pronunciation for Ricco is RIKK O. (really REEK O)

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Re: name changes

Postby ar928 » 11 Jul 2006, 04:52

suanj wrote:for to better help you, please you write here also the first name, probable birthyear, where he lived, spouse name etc.. regards, suanj


As I said in the post I'm in the process of doing that..the most i know is that they eventually settled in Catskill, NY, which is where my grandfather was born and passed away.

In the event I can't find the original Italian name, does anyone think it was possible that he was entered into the Ellis Island database with the Rich surname?

Is this Americanization a common thing? Neither the language nor customs were passed down in my family either, which is sort of unfortunate, because i could know four languages right now haha.

It's funny how a lot of them did not want to talk about their travels, my grandfather did not talk about it much either even when I pressed him hehe.

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Re: name changes

Postby ar928 » 11 Jul 2006, 05:29

A few more tidbits of information that I just remembered/found. I learned that my grandfather (John Anthony Rich), was born to an Anthony Steven Rich and Mariella Porto (who has a brother named Sonny Porto or something to that effect), in Catskill, NY, in 1929.

They also owned an inn there for a while, until **SPAM** it.

I think I'll have to try and figure this out through the Porto line, since I doubt there was a name change there.

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Re: name changes

Postby suanj » 11 Jul 2006, 11:35

if someone can look up this 1930 census

about the family and for to know almost the year of immigration:

Anthony C Rich city, Greene, info abt 1896 location

-----------------------
and this is the record of your John:

John RICH
Birth Date: 2 Sep 1929
Death Date: 24 Apr 2006
Social Security Number: 051-22-1241
State or Territory Where Number Was Issued: New York

Death Residence Localities
ZIP Code: 12414
Localities: Catskill, Greene, New York
Cementon, Greene, New York

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Re: name changes

Postby nuccia » 11 Jul 2006, 13:27

Is This it suanj?

1930 United States Federal Census Recordinfo
about Anthony C Rich
Name: Anthony C Rich
Age: 34
Estimated birth year: abt 1896
Birthplace: New York
Relation to head-of-house: Head
Race: White
Home in 1930: Robberson, Greene, Missouri

No immigration date given..can't linnk..gottta go to work. I'll link wen I get back.

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Re: name changes

Postby suanj » 11 Jul 2006, 13:47

Thanks Nuccia, is not a italian... so I must to search some other record... thanks, kisses, suanj
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Re: name changes

Postby suanj » 11 Jul 2006, 13:50

perhaps someone of this:
1930 census
View Record John Rich city, Greene, info abt 1881 Italy
Stephen Rich name Rich city, Greene, info abt 1895 location info
View Record Lillian Rich name Rich city, Greene, info abt 1907 info
Mary Rich name Rich,
name Rich city, Greene, info abt 1928 info
View Record Joseph Rich name Rich city, Greene, info abt 1905 info
View Record Stella Rich name Rich city, Greene, info abt 1907 info
View Record Cordele Rich name Rich city, Greene, info abt 1919 info
View Record Clarence E Rich name Rich city, Greene, info abt 1878 location info
View Record Florence L Rich name Rich city, Greene, info abt 1898 info
View Record Christina M Rich name Rich,
name Rich city, Greene, info abt 1914
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Re: name changes

Postby vj » 12 Jul 2006, 04:52

for suanj :wink: ,

RICH
possible 1930 US Census
ancestry.com page 30 of 35
Athens, Greene, NY
Brick Row, owns home
- RICK (RICH), Anthony, 22 (abt 1907), married age 20 (abt 1927),
b in NY, parents b in Italy, laborer - brick yard
- wife Mariella, 17, (abt 1912-3), b in NY, parents b in Italy
- son John, 7 mos, b in NY

several other RICH families on same census page:

- RICH, Carmine, 43 (1886-7), 1st marriage age 36, immig 1899 Al,
laborer - brick yard, owns home $500
- wife Angeline, 38 (1891-2), 1st marriage age 19, immig 1896 Al

- RICH, John, 49 (1880-1), widower, immig 1897 Na
laborer - general work, rents home $8
- son Joseph, 25 (1904-5), b in NY
- daughter Stella, 23 (1906-7), b in NY
- daughter Cordela, 29? (1900-1), b in NY

pg 28 of 35, another RICH family on another page, on Brick Row also:

- RICH, Stephen, 28 (1901-2), married age 25, b in NY, parents b in Italy
laborer - brick yard, rents home $9
- wife Lillian, 26 (1903-4), married age 23, b in NY, parents b in Italy
- daughter Mary, 1 yr 5 mos, b in NY

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Re: name changes

Postby vj » 12 Jul 2006, 05:06

possible related census 1910
Athens, Greene, NY
RICCI, Carmine, boarder, single, 33, immig 1903 Al
dumper - brick yard

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Re: name changes

Postby vj » 12 Jul 2006, 08:06

PORTO family information

The Daily Mail
February 28, 2003
Thomas V. Porto Sr.
World War II veteran

Catskillâ€â€

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Re: name changes

Postby vj » 12 Jul 2006, 09:39

PORTO/MISASI family

possible manifest
g-g-grandfather (g-grandmother Mariella Rich's father)
Francesco PORTO, 18, single
SS Vincenzo Florio, 15 Mar 1905, Napoli to NY, line 27
last residence Paterno C. (may be Paterno Calabro, Cosenza), going to Glasgow (Glasco), Ulster, NY, joining uncle Giovanni Pugliesi?
http://ellisisland.org/EIFile/popup_wei ... &line=0027

possible manifest
g g granduncle (g g grandmother Clara Porto's brother/cousin?)
(note: living w/Frank & Clara Porto on 1920 Census in Athens, Greene, NY)
Gaetano (Thomas) MISASI, 16, single
SS Citta Di Torino, 17 Mar 1903, Napoli to NY, line 8
last residence Paterno, going to Glascow (Glasco), Ulster, NY, joining brother Luigi Misasi
http://ellisisland.org/EIFile/popup_wei ... &line=0008

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Re: name changes

Postby vj » 12 Jul 2006, 09:55

ar,
So far, these records are possible links to your family based on the information you've shared.
There are a lot of experts here that can help if anything we've put up so far looks like it may be correct.
Ship manifests are free at: http://www.jewishgen.org/databases/EIDB ... close&LNM=
Several of us have access to ancestry.com for census & military records.
If the town in Italy for your family can be confirmed, there are usually terrific original records at your local Family History Center (you can order for a small fee)
We can also direct you to other sources on the internet & addresses to write in Italy.
What do you think??
vj

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Re: name changes

Postby ar928 » 15 Jul 2006, 05:19

Alright, i have confirmed that

RICH
possible 1930 US Census
ancestry.com page 30 of 35
Athens, Greene, NY
Brick Row, owns home
- RICK (RICH), Anthony, 22 (abt 1907), married age 20 (abt 1927),
b in NY, parents b in Italy, laborer - brick yard
- wife Mariella, 17, (abt 1912-3), b in NY, parents b in Italy
- son John, 7 mos, b in NY

They are definitely my great-grandparents, as I forgot that my grandfather was indeed born in Athens, so the 7mos. old is him haha. That's funny to think he was once that young.

Also

Francesco PORTO, 18, single
SS Vincenzo Florio, 15 Mar 1905, Napoli to NY, line 27
last residence Paterno C. (may be Paterno Calabro, Cosenza), going to Glasgow (Glasco), Ulster, NY, joining uncle Giovanni Pugliesi?


He is for sure my grandfather's grandfather on his mom's side, as that obituary of Thomas Porto confirms that (Charlie Porto, my grandfather's uncle, I met at his funeral, and Frank and Clara did indeed have 9 kids.)

Right now I am trying to find at least a first name for my great-great grandfather (on the rich side), and my dad remembers that he was told the name was changed from Riccio to Rich at Ellis Island.

I was also trying to find Clara Misasi on the ship manifest...but I can't find her, is it possible she was born in the US? Even though her brothers/cousins Luigi and Gaetano came in 1900/1900. Are there ship manifests from before 1892? Also could you find her age in the 1920 or '30 census?


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