Help please, confused newbie

Over 25 million Italians have emigrated between 1861 and 1960 with a migration boom between 1871 and 1915 when over 13,5 million emigrants left the country for European and overseas destinations.
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gennattasio
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Help please, confused newbie

Postby gennattasio » 31 Aug 2007, 04:12

My grandfather came to the US age 5 and never naturalized. He married my grandmother who was 1st generation born in the US. Does that mean my grandfather automatically became a citizen through marriage? My grandmother's parents did not naturalize so does that mean they became citizens when they had their children here? None of them renounced their Italian citizenship. Am I able to try for Italian dual cit. or not with these circumstances?

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Re: Help please, confused newbie

Postby mler » 31 Aug 2007, 12:03

Hi Gennattasio,

Give us some dates so we can confirm it for you, but based on the brief history you provide, there seems to be a good chance that you qualify.

Before 1922 (the year the Cable Act was enacted) women in the U.S. took the citizenship of their husbands. It never worked the opposite way. Your grandfather could only obtain U.S. citizenship through naturalization. If he did not naturalize or naturalized after your dad (mom) was born (if your mom, your birthday must be post-1948), you would qualify through that line. Remember, though, that your grandfather could have naturalized as a minor if his parents naturalized.

You may also qualify through your grandmother depending on birth years. Parents did not (and do not) automatically obtain citizenship through their children.

You only need one line to qualify, but if you have more than one possibility, you can choose the easiest route in terms of obtaining documents and in terms of dealing with the fewest number of discrepancies.

So, give us some more details, and we can determine what lines work for you.

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Re: Help please, confused newbie

Postby gennattasio » 31 Aug 2007, 19:24

As of yet I haven't found the naturalization records for anyone. My grandmother Luisa was born in the US, Feb. 1900, her parents; Francesco and Maria , along with her grandparents; Pasquale and Rosamaria, immigrated to the US in 1892. Giuseppe my grandfather was born in Italy Aug. 1897. He immigrated to the US with his parents; Francesco and Francesca plus two other siblings in 1901.
Giuseppe and Luisa married in Oct. 1916. My father Francesco was born in the . My grandfather Giuseppe died in Sept. 1939. He always said he was born in Newark or New York, he also said he was a fireman, neither of which were true.

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Re: Help please, confused newbie

Postby mler » 31 Aug 2007, 19:31

Because of the 1948 rule, you will need to go through the father, grandfather, greatgrandfather line. If neither your greatgrandfather nor your grandfather naturalized, the Italian line was not broken.

In order to apply for citizenship, you will need to document this with a "no record" letter from the Department of Homeland Security (G-639 is the form).

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/ ... f3d6a1RCRD

Because your grandfather immigrated as a child, you need to determine if he naturalized as a minor with his father. If the Dept. of HS has no naturalization records for them, you are good to go.

The search for naturalization records is often time consuming. So if I were you, I would make this request asap and begin gathering the other documents while you wait.

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Re: Help please, confused newbie

Postby gennattasio » 31 Aug 2007, 19:45

Thanks for the quick response. Does that mean I have to request it from the federal gov. and not the state?

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Re: Help please, confused newbie

Postby mler » 31 Aug 2007, 22:19

Yes. If you use the regional NARA offices, you will only get information for that region. The Italian consulate can then legitimately make the claim that it would have been possible for your ancestor to naturalize in another region.

The regional facilities are helpful only in obtaining actual naturalization documents, not in determining the nonexistence of such documents.

If you suspect, however, (or you think the consulate might suspect) that your ancestor naturalized before 1906, you may have to check regional records as well.

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Re: Help please, confused newbie

Postby gennattasio » 01 Sep 2007, 09:08

If a petition was made but denied does that have any effect on obtaining dual sit.?

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Re: Help please, confused newbie

Postby mler » 01 Sep 2007, 11:54

That's a new one. I've not heard of petitions being denied, but I suppose it happened.

Usually the procedure is a Declaration of Intent, followed by Petition, followed by the Oath. Until the Oath is taken, no naturalization takes place. Usually the Oath also lists the date of naturalization, and that's the date that counts. A petition w/o an oath would not affect dual citizenship.

However, if you have located a petition, check carefully because the oath usually follows soon after the petition date.

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Re: Help please, confused newbie

Postby pastasugo » 02 Sep 2007, 04:56

Nonno's petition was almost denied. It was during World War II and Italian Americans were classified as Enemy Aliens. The FBI filed an Objection to his petition, which held it up in court for a couple of years. Finally the court ruled that since Nonno had filed his declaration of intent before the beginning of the war, he could legally file his petition.

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Re: Help please, confused newbie

Postby mler » 02 Sep 2007, 13:41

My maternal grandparents naturalized during WWII as well. It would be interesting to know if they had a similar problem. They had been in the U.S. for more than twenty years, and I wonder if the war had any impact on their decision to naturalize. I couldn't have been easy to be Italian, Japanese or German at that time.

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Re: Help please, confused newbie

Postby pastasugo » 03 Sep 2007, 05:08

Nonno arrived in 1889 and was in his seventies when he naturalized. The war and rumors of internment camps and deportations drove his decision.

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Re: Help please, confused newbie

Postby mler » 03 Sep 2007, 12:36

I'm betting was the same situation for my grandparents. Before the war there was probably no urgency. Must have been difficult for all of them.


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