giuseppe livoti...via boston?

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giuseppe livoti...via boston?

Postby warriorrabbit » 07 Jan 2008, 07:11

Hi,

I can't find the Giuseppe Livoti I'm looking for (or his wife, Maria Alosi) at ellisisland.org. Can anyone check Boston for me? I don't have Ancestry, and it might be a while before I can get to the library.

He came over in 1902 (allegedly, but I got that date from this NYC gov pdf file, and it looks like they got that from the 1925 NY census) and ended up starting a chain of chicken markets. He lived over one at 288 Elizabeth St., so if anyone feels especially nice and wants to tell me his kids' names (I've been told he had five daughters)...

Many thanks for your assistance.

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Re: giuseppe livoti...via boston?

Postby pink67 » 07 Jan 2008, 08:20

From - Boston Passenger Lists, 1820-1943:

Giuseppe Livoti Arrival date: 15 Oct 1921 abt 1895 Male Genoa, Italy Cretic

Giuseppe Livoti Arrival date: 15 Oct 1921 abt 1895 Male Genoa, Italy Cretic

Guiseppe Livoti Arrival date: 30 Nov 1905 abt 1889 Male Naples, Italy Italy Romanic

These are the Giuseppe Livoti arrived to Boston.... Tell me if you want to see the manifests...
Can you give us some more details? Maria and Giuseppe's Years of birth and place of birth or were did they resided in Italy before travelling to USA ?
Laura :)

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Re: giuseppe livoti...via boston?

Postby warriorrabbit » 07 Jan 2008, 09:27

The 1905 one would be closest; the others arrive much too late. He would have been born somewhere (I'm guessing) in the 1860s and be from Mazzarra Sant'Andrea or Barcellona Pozzo di Gotto.

Seeing as how he was this big chicken king, I thought there might be an obituary, but I checked the NY Times via my library and there wasn't one. There were a bunch of real estate transfers, though. His wife was also known as Marietta, and I guess she died in 1934 because that's when there's a probate entry for her (no info about her life). Odd that there wasn't one for him.

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Re: giuseppe livoti...via boston?

Postby suanj » 07 Jan 2008, 10:14

maybe this could be your ancestor passport:
http://img91.imageshack.us/img91/7963/l ... ss1dr1.jpg
and this could be the first travel, on Patria ship http://ellisisland.org/search/shipmanif ... 2876090654
but the Dec 21, 1895
the age matching....
also it are a Tommaso Livoti( transcribed in Sivati) joining Giuseppe brother in 183 Elizabeth st http://ellisisland.org/search/shipmanif ... 4229120039
just some suggestions... regards, suanj
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Re: giuseppe livoti...via boston?

Postby warriorrabbit » 07 Jan 2008, 16:30

That passport might be his. Poultry merchant (as one NY Times article called him) could be grocer, and at that time he might not have had his own stores yet. At the same time, any relative who worked with him (and they all did) might also have called themselves grocers, and many had the same name. (This is when the naming tradition becomes annoying.)

He did have a brother Tomaso, also Orazio, Giovanni, and Carmelo, and three sisters, too, who also came over. Apparently he bought several buildings on Elizabeth St. and many of his relatives lived there (he sponsored his brothers, nephews, etc., and they all came over and worked in his chicken markets). Almost all of the Livotis coming over list Giuseppe Livoti on Elizabeth St., including my great grandfather (Giuseppe's brother-in-law).

The problem is that there are so many of them with the same name. On the boat right below the Tomaso you pointed out is a cousin Giuseppe Livoti (and two other cousins), traveling with Maria Piccolo (who I think later became his wife) who is also going to see Giuseppe Livoti. If the passport is the one I'm looking for, then both Giuseppe Livoti's are 30 in 1900, which doesn't help, and with wives named Maria.

The passport is awesome. Did you find it through Ancestry?

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Re: giuseppe livoti...via boston?

Postby suanj » 07 Jan 2008, 16:38

yes on ancestry the passport... abt Tommaso ship's manifest in travel with wife and joining Giuseppe Livoti brother, well also the cousin Giuseppe Pietrafitta joining Giuseppe Livoti couisin in 289 Elizabeth st.. Giuseppe Livoti and Maria Piccolo are citizens on the ship's manifest... this seems to match..... with passport....
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Re: giuseppe livoti...via boston?

Postby suanj » 07 Jan 2008, 16:50

maybe this record could be interesting for you:

in Elizabeth St

1910 United States Federal Census
about Gauseppe Livolto
Name: Gauseppe Livolto
[Giuseppe Livoto]
Age in 1910: 37

Estimated Birth Year: abt 1873
Birthplace: Italy
Relation to Head of House: Head
Father's Birth Place: Italy
Mother's Birth Place: Italy
Spouse's Name: Maria
Home in 1910: Manhattan Ward 14, New York, New York
Marital Status: Married
Race: White
Gender: Male
Year of Immigration: 1895
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Gauseppe Livolto 37
Maria Livolto 28
Carmela Livolto 4
Mariannina Livolto 3
Candida Livolto 1 1/12


http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/7906 ... otieq8.jpg
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Re: giuseppe livoti...via boston?

Postby suanj » 07 Jan 2008, 16:56

if the previous census is right, this is of 1920:
1920 United States Federal Census
about Joseph Trivato
Name: Joseph Trivato
[Joseph Livoti]
Home in 1920: Manhattan Assembly District 2, New York, New York
Age: 49 years
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1871
Birthplace: Italy
Relation to Head of House: Head
Spouse's Name: Mary
Father's Birth Place: Italy
Mother's Birth Place: Italy
Marital Status: Married
Race: White
Sex: Male
Home owned: Rent
Year of Immigration: 1890
Able to read: Yes
Able to Write: Yes
Image: 1029
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Joseph Trivato 49
Mary Trivato 38
Carmella Trivato 14
Mary Trivato 12
Candida Trivato 11
Congetta Trivato 8
Frances Trivato 6
Jennie Trivato 4/12

1 - http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/6862 ... ti1vo0.jpg
2 - http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/7781/1 ... ti2cq9.jpg


it seems matching... 284 Elizabeth st
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Re: giuseppe livoti...via boston?

Postby warriorrabbit » 10 Jan 2008, 16:48

Wow, thanks for this (didn't see it earlier). I actually spent a couple hours at the library yesterday, and though I found the 1920 Trivati Livotis, I didn't find the 1910 Livolto Livotis (census folks never seemed able to get the names right on them). Theoretically there should be a record for Giuseppe in 1900, too; I'll have to check other misspellings.

The NYC gov-produced pdf (on NOHO historical buildings, actually quite interesting) that I linked to earlier has my G. Livoti living at 288 Elizabeth St. They got all their info from tax and property records, so it seems odd that they say 288 and the census says 284, but apparently he owned much of Elizabeth St. and it's not that big a difference. Maybe the technical street address was 288 but the front door was at 284. The NOHO doc is all about who built the buildings, the architecture, the additions/alterations...I'm pretty sure they're correct. And the NY Times property transfers I found also said 288. It's interesting.

Thank you!

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Re: giuseppe livoti...via boston?

Postby suanj » 10 Jan 2008, 16:51

suanj wrote:maybe this record could be interesting for you:

in Elizabeth St

1910 United States Federal Census
about Gauseppe Livolto
Name: Gauseppe Livolto
[Giuseppe Livoto]
Age in 1910: 37

Estimated Birth Year: abt 1873
Birthplace: Italy
Relation to Head of House: Head
Father's Birth Place: Italy
Mother's Birth Place: Italy
Spouse's Name: Maria
Home in 1910: Manhattan Ward 14, New York, New York
Marital Status: Married
Race: White
Gender: Male
Year of Immigration: 1895
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Gauseppe Livolto 37
Maria Livolto 28
Carmela Livolto 4
Mariannina Livolto 3
Candida Livolto 1 1/12


http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/7906 ... otieq8.jpg

I believe this right record for 1910 census...
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Re: giuseppe livoti...via boston?

Postby warriorrabbit » 10 Jan 2008, 17:02

I'm really trying to solve a larger mystery, and I thought I was on to something for a while.

Giuseppe Livoti had several brothers and sisters. One brother, John, has a descendant who told me Giuseppe married Carmela Maria Piccolo. Another brother, Orazio, has a granddaughter that told me Giuseppe married an M. Alosi. The gov-produced NOHO study listed his wife as Maria A. Livoti, so I was hopeful the A was for her maiden name of Alosi. The NY Times real estate transfers had his wife as Maria/Marietta Livoti. So I began to think the first relative was wrong, and the second relative, Orazio's granddaughter, was right. Until you found the manifest, and there's Maria Piccolo.

What I'm really trying to figure out is the following: My grandfather's parents came here in 1900. They had my grandfather, and returned to Italy. Later, my grandfather's younger brother married Orazio (Giuseppe's brother) Livoti's daughter (she'd returned to Italy to visit or go to school). That seemed to be it, no relationship to the other Livotis.

However, then I found my great grandfather's manifest from when they came here in 1900, and saw that he listed Giuseppe Livoti (the poulterer with several Elizabeth St. properties and who sponsored all of his relatives to come work in his chicken markets) as his brother-in-law. So now I'm trying to figure out...how. When the one relative said G. Livoti's wife was M. Alosi, that was great, because my grandfather's mother was an Alosi. But now it looks like G. Livoti's wife is a Piccolo, like the other relative said.

Arrgh! I am confused.

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Re: giuseppe livoti...via boston?

Postby suanj » 10 Jan 2008, 17:04

well... it is a long search....
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