Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

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Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

Postby ptrotti » 21 Jul 2008, 23:42

In my quest for looking in to the Trotti name i have come to a big stump, Italy!!! I have found most of the family from the states and have come backwards to Italy. the Name of my 5th great-grandfather was named Gasper Joseph Trotti, born: Nov 1, 1740 in Turin, Italy. When in 1767 Dr. Andrew Turnbull took a group of poeple (around 200 Greeks, 100 Italians, 100 of various nationalities) to the new colony in the U.S. On the way there the ships stopped in the islands of Minorca, where the men where aloud to "find" wives. Young Gasper indeed found a wife by the name of Clara Julia Coroneus, daughter of Jori coroneus and Juanna Maris Gomila. the marriage record for Gasper states the name for him is: Gasper Trotti Pugno, son of Bartholmeo and Theresa Maria. The records that i have found state the father of Gasper is Bartholmeo Laurence Trotti born in Italy in 1686 and died 1756 Turin, Italy. His wife Theresa Maria, is all the information I have on her. Bartholmeo's farther was named Peter Trotti, born in Switerzerland, and died in 1606, Chivazzo, Piedmont, Italy. Peter's Father, Anthony Trotti born 1576 and died 1662 in Voltelline, Switzerland. It is said that he was part of Teutonic Order, but the dates that i have found state: Antooine, Count of Trotti born 1627 died 1681, Part of the Teutonic Order, Knights of the Golden Fleece under the House Of Habsburg.

So, I guess my question is, how do i find Gasper J. Trotti, his mother and father and brothers (had two; but names unknown) in Turin, Italy? Would the records from that time period still be there?

I thank you for any help!!
Paul

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Re: Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

Postby Lucap » 22 Jul 2008, 07:46

Wow, great story!
I think you need to find a good researcher there, in Turin (it will cost you a little, but probably it's the only way to find the informations you want)

Luca

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Re: Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

Postby ptrotti » 22 Jul 2008, 17:42

Thank you,

I think that I might have to do that, not sure of any other way to find out information.

Again thanks!

Paul

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Re: Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

Postby sylogician » 24 Aug 2008, 22:14

Paul,

I'm a descendant of Gaspar as well. I've researched the Trotti's of Alessandria and Milan based on books and tables by Felice Calvi (1880) and Prince Francesco Guasco (1926).

Count Antonio Trotti (1627-1684) is probably not a direct relative. He was the son of the renowned Giovanni Galeazzo Trotti (1599-1670) who began his military career as a Captain serving Spain and ended as Field Marshall of Milan. Antonio served as a Captain for Spain and a Colonel of German infantry, before raising his own troops to fight in Portugal as a General. Antonio had four daughters and one son (Paola Maria, Maria Julia, Maria Victoria, Rosa Maria and Giovanni Galeazzo) but his son (a Captain) died in a duel in Novi, unmarried.

As far as my research goes, there are two stems of the Trotti name, both of which pass through and then blossom out from Castellazzo (formerly Gamondio) around the year 1000 then take root in Alessandria and begin to spread out into Milan, Florence, Venica and Turin as military officers, jurists and minor nobility.

The oldest seem to stem from the time of the Lombard invasion. Here's a quote from Calvi: "Diamante Marinoni, in the book entitled: Senatus Mediolanensis, (Senate of Milan) says they issued from a castle called Troito, from which the name of Trotti derives; when the Goths destroyed the castle, they emigrated to Viterbo where in the course of time they left and married into the families of Gamondo (Castellazzo)." More from Calvi: "An armorial chronicler, Theudorus Hoepingius in "de Jure insignium" on Card 347, traces the origin of the Trottis to Saxony." It is likely that these earliest Trottis may trace to the same source as the Trott family who came from Halle just South of Brandenburg.

The second stem of Trotti's probably adopted the Trotti name when they came into possession of Trotti lands around Alessandria around the year 1000. This line traces back to an Uncle of Charlemagne who as Prince of the Lombards accompanied his Emperor-nephew South into Italy during a major Frankish invasion and was rewarded with lands in the newly occupied territories around Milan.

I'm still in the process of translating the Calvi and Guasco tables. Since they tend to follow lines of primogenitor, there are many lines that do not get treated at all. I think it likely some adventurous young second son followed a military career with the Hapsburgs that landed him up in Prussia with the Teutonic knights, and then generations later when the Teutonic order ws stamped out a later descendant came back down to the family's ancestral home in the Valtelline hoping to hook back up with the prospering Southern line. Gaspar likely came from this sort of line. Still, I'm hopeful the stem will be contained in the tables.

I was planning a trip abroad next year for research, but with the dollar tanking against the Euro, that will have to wait.

Good luck, I'll keep you posted as I find more.

David Trotti

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Re: Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

Postby sylogician » 25 Sep 2008, 02:25

Paul,

I don’t know if you’ve passed this way again, but in case you do I thought I’d share some more Trotti history.

I was surfing the net and came across a real estate ad for an apartment at the Trotti Villa on Lake Como in Bellagio (more on that at the end of the post) and the connection to Count Antonio Trotti spurred me to add to this thread.

The Trotti villa was purchased in 1752 by Lodovico Trotti (1729-1808) who was the grandson of the Lodovico Trotti (1667-1704) who was the universal heir of Count Antonio Trotti mentioned in the previous post (Antonio having died without any male heirs).

Unfortunately for us, we are not direct descendants of this line either. But I thought you might be interested in the following information about Lodovico’s lineage.

LODOVICO Born 3 March 1667. Settled permanently in Milan. In 1684 he became Gentleman of Casalcermelli and Marquis of Incisa upon the death of Antonio Trotti, who died without heirs. He was universal heir of Count Giovanni Galeazzo Trotti and Monsignor Lorenzo Luigi Trotti, bishop of Pavia. On 5 February 1688, with his descendants, he was made a Marquis by Ranuzio Farnese, Duke of Parma and Piacenza. He also assumed the Lordship of Fresonara upon the complete extinction of males from the lineage of Giovanni Galeazzo (the father of Antonio, mentioned above) and thus obtained the entire feud on 21 January 1689. On 5 September 1704 he gave his testament, notarized by Giovanni Battista Clerici (from Milan), and died eight days later.
LORENZO GALEAZZO Born 2 November 1702. For twelve years he was educated in the college of the PP. Jesuits in Parma. He obtained from the Emperor Carlo V the confirmation of the title of Marquis for him and his male descendants (17 August 1718). He acquired from the Belcredi the feud of Vinzaglio and with that feud, the title Gentleman, on 7 August 1730. He died in November 1737.
LODOVICO Born on 7 November 1729. He was educated in the Roman Seminary. An educated man, he was a great collector of written works. He constructed the huge villa that still to this day can be admired in Bellagio, on Lake Como, and another at Verano, near Monza, encircled by an immense park, between these dwellings he moved regularly. He was a Gentleman of the House to the Austrian Court. He was a Knight of the Golden Key and a Mauritian Knight. He expanded his palace in Milan. He began construction on the new parochial church of Casalcermelli in 1773 and completed and consecrated it in 1781.Died 3 March 1808 and was buried in Verano in the Cappuccin Monastery, by the friars for whom he had acquired it.
LORENZO GALEAZZO Born 19 March 1757. Gentleman of the Chamber to the Austrian Court (21 December 1776); He graduated in Rome on 7 February 1778. Decurion of Milan. On 25 August 1789 he was named Knight of SS. Maurizio and Lazzaro. Traveled widely: he visited England in 1768, in 1787 and 1791, Spain and Portugal in 1788, Paris in 1789, and was in Vienna, Germany and Poland in 1793, and Denmark, Sweden and Russia in 1794. In 1795 he moved to Vienna, where he remained for nearly ten consecutive years. He returned to Milan for a short visit, after approximately fourteen years of absence, to deal with a police matter involving the then ruling Cisalpine Republic, who held him under suspicion. He returned to Vienna, and some years later permanently moved to Milan, where he was a community councilman (1828-30 and 1832-34). On 4 May 1815 he was named Imperial Chamberlain. He died on 4 June 1840.

Anyhow, that’s a little from the tables I’m still translating. As for the apartment available in the Trotti Villa at Lake Como, follow the link below for the Real Estate ad. It’s a steal at € 1.4 million.

Trotti Apartment on lake Como
http://www.halldis.com/extra/re.action? ... ent_sale_1

Good hunting,

David Trotti

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Re: Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

Postby sylogician » 23 Oct 2008, 03:02

In the event Paul (or anyone else interested in the Trotti line) stumbles across this site and does a search, I've decided to add a little bit to this thread once a month. As that deadline is coming up, I thought I'd get a jump on it and share a little bit about the Trotti coat of arms.

Here’s a key to the most common ones.

Trotti, Trotti-Sandri, Pico-Trotti, Fala-Trotti
Arms: Split gold and blue.
Crest: the head of a leopard of gold, adorned by two peacock quills emanating from the ears.
Motto: Fides et Amor.
Origin: The original arms of the Trotti family are uncanny in their simplicity. A split shield of Gold and Blue with no other adornment. The true origin is shrouded in history, but two theories predominate. The first dates to the year 1050. According to Trotti-Sandri tradition, the Knight Guglielmo Trotti (who first led the family to Gamondio) wore a pendant around his neck of lapiz and gold into battle. This talisman led to the adoption of the colors as the family arms. The second is that the arms are of Saxon origin, and predate the Lombard invasion of Roman Italy. Neither case can be proven.

Trotti-Bentivoglio
Arms: In Quarters: the first and fourth quarters, split gold and blue (Trotti); the second and third, diagonally indented red and gold (Bentivoglio); and above all, on red a gold papal umbrella* with two keys, teeth up, crossed, the right of gold, the other of silver, bound by blue.
Crest: the head of a leopard of gold, adorned by two peacock quills emanating from the ears.
Motto: Fides et Amor and Quae me sustinent porto.
The papal umbrella was granted by Pope Bonifacio IX to Andreino Trotti in 1392. Giovanni Bentivoglio, Gentleman of Bologna, granted his coat of arms and cognome to Antonio Trotti 25 December 1478.
* the Papal ombrellino is a ceremonial umbrella, often called a gonfalone by the Italians


Trotti-Secco-Borella
Arms: Split on top (the arms of the Trotti-Bentivoglio); the bottom, in quarters: in the first and fourth quarter of blue with a fiammella of red (the arms of Borella), the second and third parts of silver with a red lion grasping in the right arm a sword of black in defense, with a blue band containing three or four silver flowers crossing it (the arms of Secco).
The Trotti, Gentleman of Vimercate, added to their coat of arms that of Secco Borella when the feud of Vimercate was inherited from them in 1733.

Trotti-Secco-Borella (Napoleonic Arms)
Giuseppe Trotti was granted arms by the court of the Emperor Napoleon in 1810.
Arms: In quarters: the ancient coat of arms. In the 1st red with a branch of silver and oak leaf of gold and in the 4th blue with a Peony flower of five leaves of red, bordered with silver and a gold center.

Trotti of the Chetardie
Arms: On a red background, two silver cats, one above the other.
Origin: The arms of the Chatard, Gentlemen of Chetardie, were assumed in 1545, along with the last name, by Giuseppe Trotti, son of Giovanni Trotti and Margherita Chatard, daughter of Pietro, Gentleman of Chetardie, sole heir of the Chatard family.


Trotti of the Carretto
Arms: Quartered; in the first and fourth quarters: five gold bands and five red bands (Carretto); in the second and third quarters: bars of black and gold (Ceva); central above all: split gold and blue (Trotti). Maxim: Non vi sed virtute.
Sandri-Trotti Counts of Mombasiglio carry, properly, the coats of arms of the Marquis of Carretto and of Ceva, these descended in 1602 from Fausta Maria wife of Odino Maria Sandri-Trotti, inheriting daughter of Carlo of Ceva and Barbara del Carretto.


Trotti of Ferrari

Arms: Spilt Gold and Blue, with an imperial eagle in black over all and surmounted by an imperial crown.
Note: I have seen two variations on this. One is the traditional two headed eagle of the Holy Roman Empire. The second is a single headed German Eagle. I am still in the process of translating when the imperial eagle and crown were granted.
Motto: Fides et Amor.

As far as the descendants of Gaspar Joseph Trotti go, the most likely arms are the original. There is a slim chance the Germanic or Imperial Eagle is part of his lineage. Because of the dates the others were formalized, it is unlikely Gaspar's forebearers were part of the Bentivoglio, Carretto or Chetardie lines after the integration of the new heraldry.

That's it for October. Keep hunting and having fun with history. If anyone has an opinion on the Germanic and Imperial Eagles, I'd be interested to hear thoughts. The SRI Eagle seems to associate with Ferrara and the Germanic with Milan during the Franco-Spanish conflict.

David Trotti

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Re: Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

Postby nuccia » 23 Oct 2008, 07:16

sylogician

Thank you for thinking to add to this thread regularly. I also find it fascinating and am enjoying reading about it. It will definitely be useful to someone one day, and meanwhile it makes excellent reading.

:)
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Re: Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

Postby sylogician » 20 Nov 2008, 05:10

Nuccia,

Thank you for the kind words. I'm glad you're enjoying it and hope others will find it useful. In that spirit, another month, another post... (it's a long one so we'll see how many characters I'm limited to and may split it up over a few).

This time around, I’d like to cover Gaspar Joseph Trotti’s backstory and how a strapping young Italian man wound up in British East Florida in 1768.

Go back a few years to 1763 and the end of the “Seven Years Warâ€

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Re: Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

Postby sylogician » 28 Dec 2008, 04:18

So I thought this month I’d revisit some of the early Trotti family history mentioned in a previous post. As noted, the true origin of the Trotti name is shrouded in the history of Medieval Italy. But there is a clear record of genealogy that traces the Trotti name from the present day back to the year 1165 AD and beyond.

ENRICO DI MONTABONE assumed the name “TROTTOâ€

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Re: Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

Postby trottitdf » 04 Jan 2009, 00:43

The Trotti of the Argentine. I am looking for town or city that my great-grandfather was born Giacomo (Santiago) Trotti born in 1835, married to Catherine Raggio, left Genoa and arrived in Argentina in 1868 and later had two children over seven, so in Argentina estimate that there are over 1000 Trotti at the moment, my body and others who arrived early in 1900 ... I hope any information I can give to continue my research. Thank you very much. cordially
Gustavo Trotti

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Re: Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

Postby sylogician » 04 Jan 2009, 06:36

Hola Gustavo!

I have records for the Trotti family that go back to 1165. Most branches are primogenitors and other Trottis who were successful in Milano, Alessandria, Torino, Asti and Ferrara.

Because Giacomo left from Genoa, it is probable that he was from Alessandria, Milano, Torino, Asti or Ferrara (or another town in the Piedmonte/Valtelline region).

There is another branch of Trottis from San Nicandro and Viterbo. But they usually pass through Naples when emigrating to the Americas.

Giacomo is a common name in the Trotti family. Your ancestor Giacomo (n. 1835) does not appear in these Tables. But neither does my ancestor Gaspare Giuseppe (n. 1740). But Giacomo may be from a branch of the family in these Tables.

I would be happy to email you a copy of the Tables I possess. I have hand-typed the Tables into a Microsoft Word file. I have them in English and Italian. The Tables recorded by Prince Francesco Guasco in 1926 are a good place to begin. I have others, including Tables by Felice Calvi written in 1880 and annotated records going deep into Langobard and Bavarian history.

Perhaps with these Tables and other resources available through groups like the LDS or your own research trip to Italy, you will make a connection that will take you back farther in time than you imagined.

Leave an email address here and I will forward the files to you.

Best wishes,

David Trotti

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Re: Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

Postby trottitdf » 05 Jan 2009, 16:19

David: My email is as follows trottitdf@hotmail.com; trottitdf@gmail.com; trottitdf@speedy.com.ar I hope your genealogical tables cordially Gustavo Trotti



sylogician wrote:Hola Gustavo!

I have records for the Trotti family that go back to 1165. Most branches are primogenitors and other Trottis who were successful in Milano, Alessandria, Torino, Asti and Ferrara.

Because Giacomo left from Genoa, it is probable that he was from Alessandria, Milano, Torino, Asti or Ferrara (or another town in the Piedmonte/Valtelline region).

There is another branch of Trottis from San Nicandro and Viterbo. But they usually pass through Naples when emigrating to the Americas.

Giacomo is a common name in the Trotti family. Your ancestor Giacomo (n. 1835) does not appear in these Tables. But neither does my ancestor Gaspare Giuseppe (n. 1740). But Giacomo may be from a branch of the family in these Tables.

I would be happy to email you a copy of the Tables I possess. I have hand-typed the Tables into a Microsoft Word file. I have them in English and Italian. The Tables recorded by Prince Francesco Guasco in 1926 are a good place to begin. I have others, including Tables by Felice Calvi written in 1880 and annotated records going deep into Langobard and Bavarian history.

Perhaps with these Tables and other resources available through groups like the LDS or your own research trip to Italy, you will make a connection that will take you back farther in time than you imagined.

Leave an email address here and I will forward the files to you.

Best wishes,

David Trotti

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Re: Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

Postby sylogician » 06 Jan 2009, 05:49

Gustavo,

I sent Italian and English versions to the hotmail address. If they do not arrive, let me know at sylogician@aol.com

Translation note: If you use the English version to translate to Spanish, be aware I used the English word "Mayor" for the Italian term "Podesta." English does not have an equivalent word, and Mayor was the closest. It is a uniquely Italian form of government.

Italian cities and towns would often hire a noble of good standing from another region to rule them when local rivalries and corruption became unbearable. These itinerant leaders would have great power, even over the local nobility. At the end of their contracted term, they would return home with a substantial payment or move on to the next city in need of their sevices. They would rarely be allowed citizenship and in fact were often restricted to the palace of government under guard to prevent bribery and corruption.

The Trotti family provided a large number of Podestas to many cities and towns throughout the Piedmont region.

Interestingly this form of government was widely practiced in the various city militias and state armies. Officers and leaders would be hired from distant lands to command local units. This arose out of the fear that local leaders would fill the local militia with their supporters and use them for their own ends. Occasionally this plan backfired, and the foreign leaders often inspired greater confidence in their troops than the local nobles and used the militias to capture their own cities. The Viconti and Sforzas in Milan are examples of this.

Sorry for the digression. Just substitute Podesta when you see Mayor in the English version.

David

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Re: Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

Postby bonval » 06 Jan 2009, 14:38

sylogician
Your posts are such wonderful writings! I love reading the history - just dreaming back to what all of our ancestors faced - while we complain about our economics and politics of the day, we have no idea wht real challenges are! These brave folks did not have the aid of the Internet and far-flung electronic friends and all that means for us! We are so blessed a generation to have instantly information about the world around us and events as they occur - these poor folks went through so much to improve their lives! Even for educated ones, it could not have been easy.
I have been thinking a lot about the hearships and fears and, yes, even the joys of emigrating - how frightened those women on ships sailing the oceans with small babies!?! My mother's family were from Scotland - my grandmother had been crippled by polio as a child so she had a "withered" leg - one considerably smaller and shorter. She was strong enough to bear eleven children, some of whom died young. She got on a boat in Scotland with several little ones in tow, and traveled to Ellis Island to meet my grandfather. When she arrived, he was unavailable due to work. But his BOSS answered the phone call and HE vouched for this young family, promising to care for them if my grandfather was injured or killed on the job! Then he made sure tht he and grandfather met the young family and brought them home!At least she spoke English (with her her Scottish burr) but how frightening even still for her -now imagine our families who could not understand the language!?
Anyway - did not mean to "hijack" your thread - keep up these fantastic posts - we can all learn from them!

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Re: Genealogy of surname Trotti----Help?!?!?!

Postby trottitdf » 08 Jan 2009, 01:29

TROTTI
According Gofredo di Crollalanza in his "Dizionario storico-arms and notabili Nobili delle famiglie italiane estinte and fiorenti" This is a surname originating in Italy and specifically based in Alexandria, Milan, Padua and Ferrara.
The first references to this family date back to 1000 in which he lived in Gamondio, Guglielmo Trotti and acknowledged that it was a courageous military.
One of his nephews seconds, named Manfredo Trotti was one of 36 noble citizens Milan signed in the year 1119 the privilege of exemption from all the wrongs in the monastery of Pontida.
Emanuele Trotti was one of the eight founders of the city of Alexandria.
The family was always very well regarded in Alexandria and Gamondio.
Guglielmo Trotti living in 1208 is considered one of the noblest representatives of one of the oldest and noblest families of that city, which is guarding the first of the eight keys to the ark of the relics in Duomo and Rinaldo was Trotti sent at that time as ambassador to the homeland Pope Onorio III.
This family was also charged with various characters such as Decuriones Benemérito, Counselors Ducal Gentileshombres Court, Escudero Ducal Senators Milan Vicars provisioning, jurisconsults College, Captains of Justice, Masters Field Chamberlanes etc.
Antonio Trotti was created Master Field Infantry third German in the year 1659, after he was appointed Colonel of a regiment and decree of 1675, Charles II gave him the Golden Fleece insigne di Lodovico Guarniero Marquis Trotti was created for themselves and their descendants Ranuzio Farnese, Duke of Parma and Piacenza with patent February 5 of 1688.

WEAPONS:
Coat cuartelado:
1st and 4th: cut gold and azure;
2nd and 3rd: tronchado indenting gold and red, on the whole: a shield with a red papal gonfalón gold, with the keys of St. Peter put in sotuer; chief azure charged with an anchor crossed by a silver tape same metal bearing the motto:
"QUAE ME SUSTINENT PORTO DI NERO. CURRENCY: "Fides et Amor."

CHARACTERISTICS:
Enamels symbolize:
GOLD: Nobility, Magnanimity, Wealth, Power, Light and Wisdom Constancia.
SILVER: Purity, Integrity, Obedience, Firmness Monitoring, eloquence and maturity.
AZUR: Justice, Zeal, Truth, Loyalty, and Charity Hermosura.
Gules: Fortaleza, Victoria, boldness, and Ardid Highness.
El Ancora is a symbol of hope, it also means safety and consistency, even in the biggest setbacks of fortune.


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