Comune not responding

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Squigy
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Comune not responding

Postby Squigy » 24 Feb 2010, 09:13

I sent an email to the comune of Marcianise, I believe Sept 17. 2009, I waited till Nov. 15 2009 before sending a follow up via snail mail, and after that I waited till early January before I sent a a third request. It is now almost March and still no reply. :? What should I do now? I would call if I could (that seems more direct), but I do not speak Italian. Suggestions? Thanks to all who reply.

P.S. I have also had a problem with the Comune of San Mango. Only, I did not send a third request.
My Italian surnames:

Caserta: Maietta, Rossano, Tessitore, Negro, Peluso, Musone

Campobasso: D'Andrea, Barile

Catanzaro: Fiorelli/Fiorillo, Romito

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johnnyonthespot
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Re: Comune not responding

Postby johnnyonthespot » 24 Feb 2010, 12:32

Squigy wrote:... I would call if I could (that seems more direct), but I do not speak Italian. Suggestions? Thanks to all who reply.


Do you know anyone who speaks Italian fluently and can make a call on your behalf? If you don't know anyone personally, how about hiring a translator for 15 minutes or perhaps inquiring at a local community college or similar to see if an Italian language teacher would be willing to lend a hand?
Carmine

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Re: Comune not responding

Postby PeterTimber » 24 Feb 2010, 12:50

Derar Squigy A law was passed in Italy in August 1990 (Law 241) establishes the right of the public to receive a reply from a public office within 30 days of a request.
If you go to www.circolocalabrese.org/resources/lett ... action.asp and read the Letter to the SINDACO Requesting Action!! =Peter=
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johnnyonthespot
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Re: Comune not responding

Postby johnnyonthespot » 24 Feb 2010, 13:09

PeterTimber wrote:Derar Squigy A law was passed in Italy in August 1990 (Law 241) establishes the right of the public to receive a reply from a public office within 30 days of a request.
If you go to www,circolocalabrese.org/resources/letters/sindaco_action.asp and read the Letter to the SINDACO Requesting Action!! =Peter=


Sure - piss them off even further.

I wrote that letter to the Sindaco after multiple no responses from my paternal grandfather's comune. And, do you know what? I didn't get a response from Sig. Sindaco, either.

Finally, after waiting nearly a full year, I was lucky to have an American living in Italy (and pursuing her own dual citizenship case) offer to visit the comune on my behalf. Thirty minutes after arriving, she left with my needed certificates in hand.

A few months later, I really wanted to obtain additional documents. I wrote a letter thanking the official for the "kind asistance" he showed my friend earlier and requesting some new materials. Not wanting to leave anything to chance, I had the letter professionally translated and sent it off. That was, ahem, November, 2007.

I still haven't received a response of any kind.

Law or no law, some comuni just don't see the need to respond to anything other than personal visits. Who can say - maybe that is all the law actually requires?

It's like the US FOIA law. As originally written, the law required government agencies to respond to FOIA requests within 30 days - meaning to provide the requested data/files/etc. within that time. But it was quickly perverted to mean that *any* response within 30 days met the letter of the law. Hence, a request for naturalization documents under the old FOIA plan would get you a letter (within 30 days!) telling you that the USCIS was backlogged and your request would be fulfilled in 22 - 24 months.
Carmine

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Re: Comune not responding

Postby PeterTimber » 24 Feb 2010, 13:39

I would then threaten to take my case up the adminstrative ladder and tell the SINDACO this is what you plan on doing if he does not comply with HIS law not yours! =Peter=
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johnnyonthespot
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Re: Comune not responding

Postby johnnyonthespot » 24 Feb 2010, 14:05

I do see your point, Peter.

However, this is my ancestral comune. As a dual citizen, I and my family will be relying on these civil servants in the years to come and I have no intention of making a bad situation worse.

The fact is, I don't even know for certain that they have registered our birth/marriage documents in the anagrafe yet, some 18 months after my citizenship was recognized by the NYC consulate. Some US consulates require waiting for ancestral comunes to register documents and provide an "Italian" birth certificate prior to allowing the new dual citizen to apply for his Italian passport. Luckily, NYC is not one of those consulates.

I would love to have copies of our (mine, my wife's, our son's) Italian birth and marriage acts but I greatly fear requesting them.

By the way, on January 16 of this year I sent an email to the anagrafe requesting a Certificato di Stato di Famiglia. After not receiving a response of any kind, I sent a follow-up email on January 28 asking simply, "Per cortesia mi faccia sapere se ha ricevuto la mia richiesta e quanto tempo ci vuole per avere i documenti." ("Please tell me if you have received my request and how long it may take to provide the documents.")

Apparently even that is too much to ask for. How hard would it be to simply reply to an email?
Carmine

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Romano1970
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Re: Comune not responding

Postby Romano1970 » 24 Feb 2010, 14:39

Hi Squigy.

Other points to this (from my experience). I had letters from relatives that came back (round trip) in ten days. Letters from the communes I have had not come back at all. Johny and peter have very good points on both sides of the spectrum. I would do these as delicately as possible.

I remember being very frustrated on a letter I wrote. Thinking that they were to busy to answer. One day the letter came back to me, the reason for this was as simple as not writing ITALY on the bottom of the address to the comune. I am not saying this is what you did. These things are at the will of the people who have to get the mail to the correct person. It may be as simple as the letter sitting under a pile. Do your followups and write more. I may be able to get a different email address for you. No promises but it is worth a try.
Michael Romano

Chi va piano va sano e va lontano

Those who go slowly, go safely and go far

Looking for family history in Piazza Armerina, Aidone, and Musomelli Sicily.
Names researching: Romano, Nigrelli, Ristagno, Piazza Maida Triolo.

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Re: Comune not responding

Postby johnnyonthespot » 24 Feb 2010, 14:52

Michael,

For what it is worth, I know my letters were getting through because when the friend I mentioned above went directly to the comune office, the official said to her, "oh yes, I have his letter right here" as he pointed to a stack of papers on the corner of his desk.

This is a comune of just 7500 population, by the way.

Compare to my maternal grandparents comune (~2500) which has responded to my many requests for documents in 3 weeks or less. My last request was for the birth, marriage, and death certificates of all four maternal great-grandparents; I received all ten (!) documents just a few weeks later.
Carmine

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Re: Comune not responding

Postby DeFilippis78 » 24 Feb 2010, 15:26

So maybe it has to do with size of the population...the more people the longer the wait?

Ive sent emails to several places and no response. I sent out a few letters and no response either after months. I think its the luck of the draw...whose sitting on the other side of the desk and whats their humor that day. That's the same here. You can get very friendly person or a nasty one who can care less.

Alicia

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Re: Comune not responding

Postby Italysearcher » 24 Feb 2010, 21:49

But the bottom line is their job is secure. No matter how incompetent they are they can't get fired!
Ann Tatangelo
http://angelresearch.wordpress.com
ANNOYING THE SAINTS - Stories of my Life in Italy. http://www.lulu.com/content/paperback-b ... ly/7731505

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Re: Comune not responding

Postby PeterTimber » 24 Feb 2010, 23:18

Something hints at an offense (true, innocent or imagined) that makes any resolution impossible. Someone has to know about the offense(s) committed Johnnie but perhaps a humbling letter from you to the Sindaco (you need a deputy to run interference for you and the Mayor is the only one who can rise above this mystery and resolve it (unles he is the cause?). =Peter=
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Re: Comune not responding

Postby Squigy » 24 Feb 2010, 23:59

Hi, guys, thanks for replying.

Unfortunately, I missed all the Italian speaking relatives by a generation. This would be so much easier if I learned Italian!

I think size is one factor, but Campobasso has 51,000 people and I got a reply from an email in about 10 days. Marcianise has 43,000 (not much smaller) and I am not getting any replies from emails or letters!

Anyway, as Johnny said, I don't want to make them angry, as I may have to rely on their assistance in the future. Aside from that, I have a feeling they see it as a favor to send records, not law.

Perhaps I could send a letter to the Sindaco that doesn't make him feel like I'm demanding, but asking if he could intervene in a polite way.
My Italian surnames:



Caserta: Maietta, Rossano, Tessitore, Negro, Peluso, Musone



Campobasso: D'Andrea, Barile



Catanzaro: Fiorelli/Fiorillo, Romito

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Re: Comune not responding

Postby PeterTimber » 25 Feb 2010, 00:09

Dear Squigy your response to Johnnie and my prior advice to him about writing directly to the Mayor is appreciated since you too see that as the town's leading politician it is incumbent upon him to keep "the peace" as it were. While the town can bring havoc to bear, the Mayor has to keep inmind that any potential scandal would only be to his detriment and it is this thought that would make him respond positively. =Peter=
~Peter~

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Re: Comune not responding

Postby Italysearcher » 25 Feb 2010, 14:19

I can understand your curiosity in acquiring an Italian birth certificate but I think the problem here is that you may not be stating your reason for wanting a copy. Italians don't get a copy of their birth certificate that they maintain throughout their lives and use for all purposes. When they need a copy for a specific purpose (like school or marraige) they request one from the anagrafe who issue a certificate or an extract that ranges from just your name and date of birth to a long form containing names of parents and that is valid for just six months. A photocopy of the original (like the microfilms) is simply not an option.
Ann Tatangelo
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ANNOYING THE SAINTS - Stories of my Life in Italy. http://www.lulu.com/content/paperback-b ... ly/7731505

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Re: Comune not responding

Postby johnnyonthespot » 25 Feb 2010, 14:41

PeterTimber wrote:Something hints at an offense (true, innocent or imagined) that makes any resolution impossible. Someone has to know about the offense(s) committed Johnnie but perhaps a humbling letter from you to the Sindaco (you need a deputy to run interference for you and the Mayor is the only one who can rise above this mystery and resolve it (unles he is the cause?). =Peter=


I assure you, Peter, no offenses have been committed on my part. Not real, not imagined. This particular comune simply sees no need to respond to anyone.

Besides, offense or not, they should provide documents when they are properly requested and do so in a timely manner. Regardless of their personal feelings toward the requestor.
Carmine

My hobby is finding things. Having found most of my own, I am happy to help others find theirs. PM me! :)


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