Looking for Birth Record for Carlo Simoni

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karansimoni
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Looking for Birth Record for Carlo Simoni

Postby karansimoni » 16 Jul 2010, 03:32

Hi, I am very new. Just signed up a few minutes ago. So thank you in advance for your patience,

I am trying to trace my great grandfather prior to his immigration to California. His death certificate states his DOB June 6 1872. His father was Francesco Simoni and his mother was Benvenuta (no last name listed) He lived in Kern County California (Bakersfield) for 40 years. Rumor in the family is that he was from Lucca or close by? He was widowed, and left children in Italy when he immigrated. We think he came with a cousin, who ended up in Northern California. He owned land in Italy and brought all the deeds here when he came. Trying to find out where he was from, where the properties he owned were located, and if they are still owned by his descendants. I wondered if possibly tracing real estate might help to find out more about him and his actual city of origin and immigration facts?

Thanks
Karan

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vj
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Re: Looking for Birth Record for Carlo Simoni

Postby vj » 16 Jul 2010, 13:05

Karan,
Welcome to the Forum!
It may help to identify Carlo's town in Italy if we could find his or a family member's ship manifest (if it's after abt 1898) or naturalization paperwork (after abt 1906)
It is possible to research property ownership in his comune by hiring someone who specializes in this - there are several in CA
Does this 1930 census belong to your famly?
Thank you
Valarie

possible 1930 census
http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/8848/1930p.jpg

Home in 1930:
Farm
Township 15, Kern, California

head Carlo Simoni 58, abt 1872 IT
- married age 27, abt 1899
- immig 1890, Pa (filed first papers for naturalization)
- farmer, general farm
wife Cruz A Simoni 61, abt 1869 CA
- father born in NM, mother born in CA
son Lazarus E Simoni 30, abt 1900 CA
- divorced
son Alfred Simoni 28, abt 1902 CA
- single
father Francisco Simoni 80, abt 1850 IT
- married age 19, abt 1869
- immig 1890
roomer Beles Oconnor 25

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karansimoni
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Re: Looking for Birth Record for Carlo Simoni

Postby karansimoni » 16 Jul 2010, 15:28

Yes! This is them... I found a later census that had his son Alfred (my grandfather) as the head of household and Carlo was retired... There is much more information here, Thank you SO MUCH!!! I am also trying to research Carlo's wife Cruz ancestry as well... I need her birth certificate and the marriage certificate, as well as my grandfather Alfred's birth certificate (he was born at home) to prove native american ancestry through her. This at least gives me a place to look for her... I will have to ask my Aunt if she knows when he came here, she remembers him saying he sailed around the cape of So. Africa and in to Los Angeles Harbor, instead of going to New York. But you know how these old family stories change. So far what I have been told by my father and aunt has been pretty accurate though.

When I searched at Ellis Island for him they said that I would need to check the national archives. But I don't know where to start...

You people here are really incredible! Thank you so much.

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Re: Looking for Birth Record for Carlo Simoni

Postby PeterTimber » 16 Jul 2010, 15:33

Go to www.landfinder.it which is a website for Anthony Alioto, attorney who specializes in recovering property in Italy from the late 1800's forward.

www.italianlaw.net is his website and you can send him an e-mail to Italianlaw@comcast.net in San Francisco. Hope this helps. =Peter=
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Re: Looking for Birth Record for Carlo Simoni

Postby vj » 16 Jul 2010, 15:39

Hi Karan!
I'm guessing they were married is San Bernardino County abt 1898
(their location in 1900 with son Laz)
No luck finding Carlo or his father Francesco's ship manifest - LA arrival is a good clue. Shame is the CA ship database at ancestry starts at 1893...
Do you know where Francesco was before the 1930 census
Thank you
Valarie
---

PeterTimber wrote:Go to www.landfinder.it which is a website for Anthony Alioto, attorney who specializes in recovering property in Italy from the late 1800's forward.

www.italianlaw.net is his website and you can send him an e-mail to Italianlaw@comcast.net in San Francisco. Hope this helps. =Peter=


Thank you Peter :D ,
that was the name I was trying to remember
Valarie
---

for reference, the 1900-1920 census records for Carlo & Cruz Simoni and family

1920
http://img96.imageshack.us/img96/1849/1920r.jpg
next page
http://img821.imageshack.us/img821/5093/192001.jpg

1910
http://img709.imageshack.us/img709/5618/1910v.jpg

1900
http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/4397/1900t.jpg

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johnnyonthespot
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Re: Looking for Birth Record for Carlo Simoni

Postby johnnyonthespot » 16 Jul 2010, 15:54

Carlo Simoni, correct age and time frame, arriving in New Yrok:

New York Passenger Lists, 1820-1957
about Carlo Simoni
Name: Carlo Simoni
Arrival Date: 23 Feb 1891
Birth Year: abt 1872
Age: 19
Gender: Male
Ethnicity/Race­/Nationality: Italian
Place of Origin: Italy
Port of Departure: Le Havre, France
Destination: New York
Port of Arrival: New York
Port Arrival State: New York
Port Arrival Country: United States
Ship Name: La Bretagne

What do you think? Coincidence?

PS: Not out of the question that he originally arrived in New York and then later (days, weeks, years) sailed to California instead of going cross country.
Carmine

My hobby is finding things. Having found most of my own, I am happy to help others find theirs. PM me! :)

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Re: Looking for Birth Record for Carlo Simoni

Postby vj » 16 Jul 2010, 16:45

karansimoni wrote:...I am also trying to research Carlo's wife Cruz ancestry as well... I need her birth certificate and the marriage certificate...


Was her maiden name Montoya?
1st marriage to 'Jacomini'? (children on 1910 census posted earlier)
Thank you

CA Death Index
JACOMINI, JOSEPH LUCAS
18 Oct 1884 CALIFORNIA
MONTOYA
JACOMINI
KERN 16 Sep 1953 68 yrs

JACOMINI, ROBERT WILLIAM
10 Jan 1890 CALIFORNIA
MONTOYA
JACOMINI
KERN 8 Feb 1950 60 yrs
572-01-xxxx

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Re: Looking for Birth Record for Carlo Simoni

Postby vj » 16 Jul 2010, 16:57

Montoya/Perez

possible 1880 census
http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/1664/1880d.jpg

Home in 1880:
Sumner, Kern, California

head Antonia Montoy 35, abt 1845 CA
- widowed
- parents born in CA
daughter Crus Montoy 10, abt 1870 CA
- parents born in CA
daughter Madalena Montoy 9, abt 1871 CA
- father born in NM, mother born in CA
son Conrado Montoy 9, abt 1871 CA
son Amado Montoy 5, abt 1875 CA
son Cresencano Montoy 1, abt 1879 CA
---

brother Amado?
Mother's maiden name Perez

MONTOYA AMADO
12 Apr 1872 CALIFORNIA
PEREZ
MONTOYA
CALIFORNIA
KERN 29 Jan 1945 72 yrs

edit: added

In 1900 Cruz's brother Amado may be living with his mother Antonia Perez's brother Jose? and his family in Kern County
(listed as brother-in-law in error)
1900
http://img694.imageshack.us/img694/3230/1900ag.jpg
next page
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/9867/190001g.jpg

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PeterTimber
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Re: Looking for Birth Record for Carlo Simoni

Postby PeterTimber » 16 Jul 2010, 17:04

Carmine CARLO SIMONI arrived in NYC in August 1904 on the La Bretgagne from Poleggio Italy destined to Seattle, Washington?? =Peter=
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johnnyonthespot
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Re: Looking for Birth Record for Carlo Simoni

Postby johnnyonthespot » 16 Jul 2010, 17:18

PeterTimber wrote:Carmine CARLO SIMONI arrived in NYC in August 1904 on the La Bretgagne from Poleggio Italy destined to Seattle, Washington?? =Peter=


Interesting; maybe a second trip?

I was looking for a Carlo who was born in 1872 and arrived in the US 1890 (per previous post). Of course, the 1890-era manifests have little useful information on them.
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PeterTimber
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Re: Looking for Birth Record for Carlo Simoni

Postby PeterTimber » 16 Jul 2010, 17:25

No the manifest says no previous entry thats why I questioned mark my comments? =Peter=
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vj
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Re: Looking for Birth Record for Carlo Simoni

Postby vj » 16 Jul 2010, 19:21

karansimoni wrote:... Carlo's wife Cruz ancestry as well... I need her birth certificate and the marriage certificate...


Jacomini/ Montoya/o

Kern County Marriages

possible 1st marriage for Cruz Montoya if her name was transcribed incorrectly
http://files.usgwarchives.net/ca/kern/v ... ac-jay.txt

Certificate # Date Groom Bride
275
01/31/1884
JACOMINI, LORENZ
MONTOYO, ALICE
===

Neat master search site for US
Search by name within state by record type
http://www.usgwarchives.net/search/sear ... m=extended

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karansimoni
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Re: Looking for Birth Record for Carlo Simoni

Postby karansimoni » 17 Jul 2010, 15:50

"What do you think? Coincidence?

PS: Not out of the question that he originally arrived in New York and then later (days, weeks, years) sailed to California instead of going cross country."

I think this is probably him. My dad thinks he went to San Francisco first and lived there for several years. He allegedly owned several properties in San Francisco. He didn't trust banks, so he bought real estate with his savings. Was there any ships leaving New York sailing for San Francisco with a Carlo Simoni in this time frame?

Cruz Montoya is the correct wife of Carlo. But my father reminded me yesterday, they were not legally married until Jacomini died. Lazarus and Alfred were born when she was still legally married to Jacomini. Could this be why records are difficult to find? They were born at home, so possibly Baptismal records might be an alternative?

Carlo worked for the Railroad in Los Angeles in the late 1800's and Cruz allegedly lived in Pomona with her 4 kids when Carlo met her. So maybe I should check census records for 1890 in Pomona for more info on her. She and Carlo were living together, but I don't know if it was as man and wife or not... This is some family skeleton that surfaced long after Carlo died... It gets complicated.

I will talk to my dad and aunt and see if they know the approximate age of Carlo when he immigrated, and what age he was when he lived in San Francisco and then when he worked on the Railroad. This might help narrow things down a bit...

Thanks you for the name of the attorney in San Francisco, I will contact him about the property.

Thank you everyone for all your help. You are wonderful!

Regards
Karan

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PeterTimber
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Re: Looking for Birth Record for Carlo Simoni

Postby PeterTimber » 17 Jul 2010, 16:04

ships list to California at www.germanroots.com

also www.sf.genealogy.com =Peter=
~Peter~


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