Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

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heidebock
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Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

Postby heidebock » 29 Nov 2010, 21:19

Hi, I'm a brand-newbie who was just really blown away (in a positive sense) by the esprit de corps, friendliness, & supportiveness of the people on this site! I've been on other forums and this one really is a breath of fresh air! :D

I did not, of course, stumble upon the site by accident. I'm looking for my Great Grandfather's birthplace. I've tried speaking to all remaining relatives (noone can remember), looking at obituaries, passenger manifests, census documents, etc, all to no avail. My GGF seems to have made a habit out of generalizing when asked about his birthplace/previous residence, etc: "Italy" is all I can find!

The only 'hard data' which I have is: 1) specific birthdate 2) specific name albeit a generic one (I can only hope they're accurate).

The 'soft data' which might offer some clues is: 1) he had red hair and supposedly spoke a Swiss dialect or perhaps Swiss-accented Italian; everyone seems to agree that he was from Northern Italy. 2) His wife (whom he married in the US) was from Genova and supposedly married him, in part, because he was from the same region of Italy as she.

In any case, I was hoping that someone on the forum could give me some help or advice in terms of methodology and next-steps to pinpoint his birthplace. I realize it's a tall task, but I'm hoping there's still some hope!

Regards!

Erik in Salt Lake City

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Tessa78
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Re: Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

Postby Tessa78 » 29 Nov 2010, 21:28

Hello Erik and welcome! :-)

Do you have a ship manifest for your GGF? If he immigrated after about 1899 there will be a place of last residence noted. That will give a clue.

Have you been able to find a copy of the marriage record? Where were he and your GGM married, and in what year?

If you provide GGF and GGM name, date of birth, place of residence, and names of children, if any, we will certainly try to help you on your way...

T.

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heidebock
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Re: Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

Postby heidebock » 29 Nov 2010, 22:12

Hi Tessa!

I was not able to find the actual ship's manifest for my GGF (I did find it for my GGM) - but I was able to confirm his immigration to the US through the "Italians to America Passenger Data File" from the National Archives. I have not seen the original source of this document, only an online index; I ass-umed :wink: that since his birthplace was not listed on the index it wouldn't be in the source document either.

His immigration date was actually June 6th 1887 via New York.
He and GGM were both born in Italy, met in California, and were married Feb 6, 1908 in California>Santa Clara County>San Jose.

GGF Info: Pasquale Bruno; DOB= 13 January 1860; US Residence: Oakland, then San Jose, CA.
GGM Info: Giovanna (Jennie) Firenze; DOB= 13 July 1874; US Residence: San Jose, CA.
Children: Henry, Attilio, Mary

Thanks so much! :D

Erik

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Re: Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

Postby jamiecapaldi » 30 Nov 2010, 09:56

He was a Locksmith who departed from Havre. I would more than likely say he was from North Italy, as they used Havre Port.
NAMES: Capaldi-Tedesco-Tamilio-Minchella-Verrecchia-Tomasso-Franchitto-Innelli-Arpino-Caringi-Colacicco-Macari-Pinchera-Salera-D'Orazio-Ambrosino-Di Mambro-Sigliocolo-Masello
PLACES: Cassino- UK, USA, Ireland, Canada & Australia
http://www.cassino-families.co.uk

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Re: Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

Postby johnnyonthespot » 30 Nov 2010, 13:06

heidebock wrote:
- but I was able to confirm his immigration to the US through the "Italians to America Passenger Data File" from the National Archives.



Hi, Erik.

Are you quite certain that that was your ancestor?

At Ancestry . com, I see several manifests for Pasquale Bruno's who were born "about 1860" and arrived in New York in the first decade of the 1900's.

Here is the 1887 manifest:

Image

Image

Click the thumbnail once to enlarge.
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Tessa78
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Re: Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

Postby Tessa78 » 30 Nov 2010, 14:47

1900 US Census for Pasquale Bruno, born Jan 1860, arrived 1887

1900 United States Federal Census
about Pasquale Bruno
Name: Pasquale Bruno
Home in 1900: Oakland Ward 1, Alameda, California
Age: 40
Birth Date: Jan 1860
Birthplace: Italy
Race: White
Gender: Male
Immigration Year: 1887
Relationship to Head of House: Head
Father's Birthplace: Italy
Mother's Birthplace: Italy
Marital Status: Single
Occupation: View on Image
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members:
Name Age
Pasquale Bruno 40

T.

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heidebock
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Re: Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

Postby heidebock » 30 Nov 2010, 15:13

Wow, you guys are amazing - I was unable to pinpoint the actual manifest on ancestory, even after looking through every passenger list for June 6 1887... I was unable to recognize the actual date on that scan.

We don't have any corroborating info about him being a locksmith, so that's somewhat of a surprise. Otherwise, I'm "pretty sure" I have the right Pasquale:
my reasoning is that a Pasquale Bruno was recorded in the 1900 federal census as living in California>Alameda>Oakland City. He put an immigration date of 1887 on the census form. At this point, it's not possible to be 100% sure it's him because he hasn't been married yet & has no children, BUT: 1) it's the only Pasquale Bruno that pops up in the California Bay Area 2) in FUTURE census forms (1910 & 1930), where I can correlate him to his kids, he ends up putting an immigration date of 1885 (so he's started guesstimating at this point, but it's still closest to 1887). 3) most of the other Pasquale Bruno's I saw were immigrating into the US in early 1900's, which would directly conflict with what he was telling census takers, as well conflicting with the 1900 census which "probably" already pinpoints him in Oakland.
I don't believe he practiced a locksmith trade - 1900 census listed him as a day laborer and then in future census' he was listed as a farmer.

Is there a conclusion which can be drawn off of any of this?

Regards!
Erik

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Re: Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

Postby johnnyonthespot » 30 Nov 2010, 15:19

Erik, is that your family tree posted on Ancestry . com (Ancestry member jbrunobuckland - Link)

Not much more info (dob 13 Jan 1860, dod 12 May 1932), but perhaps the poster has additional info since he/she stopped updating the tree.
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Re: Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

Postby Tessa78 » 30 Nov 2010, 15:24

Possible Naturalization Index cards for Pasquale Bruno in Supreme Court of Northern California...

Declaration - Dec. 1933
http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/4451/b ... on1933.jpg

Petition - Sept. 1936
http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/3456 ... on1936.jpg

If this is him, you might want to request records from NARA using the Declaration/Petition numbers shown.

http://www.archives.gov/genealogy/naturalization/

T.

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Re: Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

Postby Tessa78 » 30 Nov 2010, 15:26

johnnyonthespot wrote:Erik, is that your family tree posted on Ancestry . com (Ancestry member jbrunobuckland - [url=http://trees.<a href="http://www.jdoqocy.com/click-3166187-10456885" TARGET="_blank">Ancestry.com</a>/tree/13646291/person/-34866015?ssrc=]Link[/url])

Not much more info (dob 13 Jan 1860, dod 12 May 1932), but perhaps the poster has additional info since he/she stopped updating the tree.


If the DOD is correct, I guess that makes the above Naturalization records impossible... :-(

T.

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Re: Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

Postby johnnyonthespot » 30 Nov 2010, 15:32

For reference:

1900 US Census:

Image

1910 US Census:

Image

Curiously, neither the 1920 nor 1930 census jumps out when I search for them.
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Re: Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

Postby PeterTimber » 30 Nov 2010, 15:33

Erik in the family oral history is there any way to identify the region or better yet the province where Pasquale Bruno originated? Was his accent German or French?..hearsay will do. The surname locator (www.gens.labo.net/en/cognomi) puts the bulk of the Bruno surname along the border in Piemontge and Lombardia so I would put my money in that area first.

Alsoput the staue of Saint Anthony upside down until we resolve the problem! =Peter=
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Re: Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

Postby johnnyonthespot » 30 Nov 2010, 15:34

In 1930 he is listed as Paulo:

Image
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Re: Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

Postby heidebock » 30 Nov 2010, 15:40

I've pinpointed him on the 1930 census as "Paulo Bruno" - the kids still match up, etc. At this point he was still listed as an alien and he died in 1932, so I don't think he ever applied for naturalization.

Regarding anecdotal evidence surrounding his origin: red hair, Swiss-accented/dialected Italian, and the acceptance by his Genovese wife are all that I have.

Apparently he was somewhat withdrawn, especially towards the end of his life...

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Re: Newbie looking for Italian GGF's Birthplace

Postby heidebock » 30 Nov 2010, 15:41

haha - I'm having trouble keeping up with you guys!


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