finding a house sold in the 1960`s

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acartia
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finding a house sold in the 1960`s

Postby acartia » 22 Apr 2011, 16:29

My father who left Italy for Australia in the 1920s, owned a house and sold it,in I believe the 1960s. He has now gone, the agent who arranged the sale has also gone, and other relatives who lived in that region of Italy are now deceased as well. I am wondering if it is possible to track down through Italian land records, the address of the old family house, knowing of course it was in my father name.Usually things work in reverse, meaning if one knows a properties address it`s easy to find the previous owners through land records.Any one have any ideas please how to find the address of this old house (if its still there of course! it`s up in the Garfagnana region of Italy,) using say government land records .My hope one day is to get some photos of that old family home.Thanks.

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adelfio
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Re: finding a house sold in the 1960`s

Postby adelfio » 22 Apr 2011, 21:10

Was it the house he was born in? If it is you can check his Italian birth record for a address on there........

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Researching Trabia, Palermo surnames Adelfio, Bondi, Butera, Scardino,Rinella, Scardamaglia

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johnnyonthespot
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Re: finding a house sold in the 1960`s

Postby johnnyonthespot » 22 Apr 2011, 21:37

Australian immigration records that I have seen are very complete; try searching here http://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/SearchNR ... earch.aspx (just put his name in the keywords field) and see what comes up.

Let me know how you make out, or post his name and birth year and I will take a look myself.
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acartia
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Re: finding a house sold in the 1960`s

Postby acartia » 23 Apr 2011, 14:00

Thank you both for your interest and comments.I have left my Italian side of genealogy to last as my knowledge of the Italian language is near hopeless! But I did(with lots of help) obtain my father`s birth certificate a number of years back. It gives the main town...Castelnuovo di Garfagnana,(inland of Lucca and up in the mountains, I believe) and father and mother etc, but we think his house was not actually in the town proper, but one of the smaller, what should I call them townlets,hamlets around Casteluovo di Gafagnana. My other cousins in Australia have heard of three possibles in this region for the family home, namely.....Colle, Silllicano and Monteperpoli. So it is not clear at all, but it appears that all these small communes (maybe that is the word I should have used earlier)surround Castelnuovo di Garfagnana. So there is nothing I can glean from the birth certificate for exact location of the home really. Secondly I have used those Australian Commonwealth records which you directed me to, for my father, in terms of ship arrival,etc, but that was about 20 years back, after I put his name in today, I notice there are about 3 new records that I do not have, so thanks for putting me onto to that, it will add extra valuable info when I check them out in detail. Regards,John

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johnnyonthespot
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Re: finding a house sold in the 1960`s

Postby johnnyonthespot » 23 Apr 2011, 14:50

John,

Castelnuovo di Garfagnana is a comune located in Provincia di Lucca, Regione di Toscana, Central Italy. It has several frazioni (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frazione), as follows:

Antisciana
Cerretoli
Colle
Croce Stazzana
Gragnanella
Monteperpoli
Palleroso
Pettinella
Rontano
Torrite

It is the comune that you are interested in, because that is where all records are held for the frazioni which fall under its administration. You can contact the comune at:

Ufficio Anagrafe e Stato Civile
Comune di Castelnuovo di Garfagnana
Via Vallisneri, 1
55032 Castelnuovo di Garfagnana (LU)
ITALY

email: l.dini@comune.castelnuovodigarfagnana.lu.it
web: http://www.comune.castelnuovo-di-garfagnana.lu.it/

Sample letters can be found at:

http://italiangenealogy.com/forum/viewt ... 07#p108741

http://www.circolocalabrese.org/resourc ... /index.asp

http://www.angelfire.com/ok3/pearlsofwi ... tters.html

My guess is that you have a birth extract or estratto. What you want is a photocopy of the original, complete, birth act. This will nearly always include the name of the street and possibly house number where the birth occurred. The document is called a "Copia integrale dell'atto di Nascita". Include a copy of the estratto with your request to make the search easier.

You might also try requesting a "family status" ("Certificato dello Stato di Famiglia") report, however these seem much harder to come by. Search this forum or read about it here: http://genealogy.about.com/od/italy/a/family_tree_2.htm
Carmine

My hobby is finding things. Having found most of my own, I am happy to help others find theirs. PM me! :)

acartia
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Re: finding a house sold in the 1960`s

Postby acartia » 25 Apr 2011, 10:43

Carmine, thanks so much for that extra information. I reckon you are spot on, in that I only have an extract of my fathers birth certificate. I know what to expect in the Australian certificates,from most era`s, but only ever having applied for one from Italy, I just presumed that I had the full certificate, as I know details from country to country can vary a lot.I will work on getting the full certificate and also try for the Family Status if available, that you mention.It is interesting to see that two of the frazioni (I know what to call them now! But maybe I should make that plural!) are mentioned on that list you sent in.I have just checked the other one not on the list namely Sillicano and that is just north of Colle anyhow. I was going to ask another question on this page but thought I best start another thread as it maybe of interest to newbies like me as well.Even though it has no doubt been answered many time before, but I am still trying to find things on the site ,which will take a little time. So grateful for all the information you have given me, and I will let you and all know what I find in the full birth certificate regarding the old house. Regards,John

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johnnyonthespot
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Re: finding a house sold in the 1960`s

Postby johnnyonthespot » 25 Apr 2011, 13:31

acartia wrote:...It is interesting to see that two of the frazioni (I know what to call them now! But maybe I should make that plural!) are mentioned on that list you sent in.


Frazione = singular
Frazioni = plural

See http://italian.about.com/library/fare/blfare123a.htm for explanation and additional examples. :D

Here is a random example of an 1886 birth act (an "Atto di Nascita", taken from the register of "Atti di Nascita" - one act taken from the register of acts). This ancestor was born on Strada Centro (... nella casa posta in Strada Centro), no number given (al numero ____).

Image

Click once to enlarge; click again for maximum magnification.

I have seen Atti di Nascita into the first decade of the 1900's which are in the exact same format. I honestly don't know what later records might look like.
Carmine

My hobby is finding things. Having found most of my own, I am happy to help others find theirs. PM me! :)

acartia
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Re: finding a house sold in the 1960`s

Postby acartia » 27 Apr 2011, 16:06

Carmine, I am going to whisper this as I am more than a little embarrassed about my lack of observation re the birth certificate in question! Yes it does say "Estratto.......", but to make matters worse it also says in English "Extract of the register of births" So you are spot on, in believing I had only a Birth extract. My only excuse for believing it was the full birth record, (and a very poor excuse at that), was it actually has his parents name on it. I have had a West Australian extract of birth for myself,for school, drivers licence etc, and all it has on it is my full name, date of birth, and where born(suburb or hospital), but no parents names at all. So without doubt I have to try for the full birth certificate of my father. Thanks for all your help in this matter, and also the best way to pay for similar records that I will need in the future from Italy.Regards,John


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