Help finding area for surnames Cassell // Edmundi

Are you looking for an Italian surname? Do you need more information about your family heritage?
This is the right place to start your genealogy search.
49 posts • Page 2 of 41, 2, 3, 4

Re: Help finding area for surnames Cassell // Edmundi

Postby mfjp » 29 Oct 2004, 14:55

Just so I don't get confused.... both wives were French Canadian... :roll:
and his son from the first wife was born 1892..

Any info as to who his first wife was? Where they were married?... maybe you need to look for the first marriage record...maybe that could hold more info...

When he remarried... he could have remarried in the same town as the first wife...(maybe in Quebec somewhere)... ??? The French record that I looked at did not say where...

Any immigrants who crossed the US border to Canada prior to late? 1906 didn't need to show any kinds of records... they just simply got off the boat and made it to the border... and were considered "non landed immigrants on the ships manifests.. ?" Records for crossing the Canadian border to the US should exist after 1906...

maybe the St. Albans records need to be looked into...
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.com ... albans.htm

essgee could be right about entering through Canada....

suanj posted info about this ship record.... which makes good sense... (as he would have been at a good age to travel alone...)

Name: Domenico Cazzell* (my note:*Cazzell/Cassell not exist in Italy;"zz" probable "ss")
Arrival Date: 18 Mar 1891
Age: 23

well at least you have his parents name!!!

Looking at other posts, DeliBoy says Napoli... ptimber says..... Emilia Romagna, Lombardia and Piemonte regions..
User avatar
mfjp
Master
Master
 
Posts: 2217
Joined: 13 Aug 2004, 00:00

Re: Help finding area for surnames Cassell // Edmundi

Postby suanj » 29 Oct 2004, 15:19

Hi: an my suggestion:
-I think most probable that Domenico Francesco born in south Italy( why Domenico Francesco is a tipical name of south)
-ditto for Pasquale name
-about just spelling surname in Italy are Cassella, Casella, Cassello,Casello, Caselli, Casilli, Casale.. only Casella and Caselli are surnames of north and that in the time are diffused in all Italy.. all other, in years of emigration, was tipical of Italy south..
-for better search in Italy I need of some explanation(why I'm confused) and confirm:
1. Pasquale Cassell & Maria Edmundi
2. son: Domenico Francesco Cassell born in various date second various acts..
3. Domenico Francesco Cassel emigrated first time in Canada?
4. and in Canada married with Anna Robidoux born in 1887; first son Frank? (Francesco).. born in ????
5. but in USA where did they live? for me this are important.. please let me know
6. more: in my previous message about Edmundi surname, mistaken, In Italy sure exist only Edmondo surname, and in all Italy only in Salerno area/Campania region and in this region are large presence of CasillO surname; this suggestion are important whyreally are possible that Domenico Francesco coming from Campania, and why the "Cassell" english pronounce is in italian Cassill

-Domenico Francesco died in 1942..where??
-some first name of sons and daughters?Frank.. and...
Thank you, suanj
User avatar
suanj
V.I.P.
V.I.P.
 
Posts: 11216
Joined: 20 Feb 2003, 01:00
Location: Molise region, Italy

Re: Help finding area for surnames Cassell // Edmundi

Postby Cassell » 29 Oct 2004, 16:57

gm all :)
I will try my best to clear all the confusion as I think im starting to get confused LOL ( not really)
ok in a 1900 and 1910 Census in Berwick, Maine there was a Dominick Cassell he was there Married to a Mary, 1910 says he was born 1857 and was 42 then and married for 23 years. All kids but last son was born Rhode Island; last son was born Canada Fr. ( little strange) Mary said she had 8 kids by then 7 living. kids are Josephine 21, Maria or Marian 18 ( hard to read) Joseph 16, Peter 14, Roy 12 Frank 7 and John 29. IN Berwick
User avatar
Cassell
Newbie
Newbie
 
Posts: 21
Joined: 26 Sep 2004, 00:00

Re: Help finding area for surnames Cassell // Edmundi

Postby Cassell » 29 Oct 2004, 17:24

lol hipt send when opening tree lol.
In June of 1912 in Berwick, Maine he had another son named Peter, 1914 had son named John, 1915 Micheal (Middle name Robidoux), 1916 son named Anthony was born Dover, NH. ( this appears to be when this family moved to Dover by virtual records) 1917 had son named Pasquale, 1919 had daughter Mary, 1922 had son James ( died @ 10 months of age), 1925 had daughter Anna, 1926 had daughter Theresa, 1927 had son Dominick died same day, and last had daughter Annie in 1929 she too died same day. It was @ this time when Dominick and Anna got married, Oct 10, 1929 In Dover, NH. I would guess that first marriage took place in Rhode Island giving that John birth info says he was born Sept 1876 in Rhode Island, 1900 - 1876 i get age 24 he would be in Sept census done in June. Giving they said @ this time they was married 23 years then my guess is if John is his son he was born around marriage time. Which makes me question if he came into Rhode Island. 1st wife Mary states she immergrated to states in 1872.
hope this helps explain more to u all.
Awaiting ur replies,
Carol
User avatar
Cassell
Newbie
Newbie
 
Posts: 21
Joined: 26 Sep 2004, 00:00

Re: Help finding area for surnames Cassell // Edmundi

Postby DeliBoy » 29 Oct 2004, 17:36

mjfp,

"Looking at other posts, DeliBoy says Napoli"

Don't count my Napoli as an independent opinion, I was only repeating Carol's original theory at the start of her "Cassell" thread.

Congratulations to everyone here, you really seem to be getting somewhere.
User avatar
DeliBoy
Rookie
Rookie
 
Posts: 62
Joined: 31 Jul 2004, 00:00

Re: Help finding area for surnames Cassell // Edmundi

Postby mfjp » 29 Oct 2004, 19:05

I stand corrected.... but what would your independant opinion be since you are following this too? We've got 2 separate topics - (subjects) on one person... can be confusing... glad to see lots of input though! we all win... mfjp
User avatar
mfjp
Master
Master
 
Posts: 2217
Joined: 13 Aug 2004, 00:00

Re: Help finding area for surnames Cassell // Edmundi

Postby Cassell » 29 Oct 2004, 19:15

hiya all :)
Yes he was quite a man to say the least lol. But it is wonderful of u all to be of such help to me in this and for that i am enternally grateful to u all ! Giving all ur help we are starting to narrow down area in Itally YEAHHHHH ! tytyty.
I think the misspelling of names, first and last on alot of this is simply in this day census takers, town records etc couldnt spell em and put it down as it sounded. But its from these records that I have come to spell em as i have till i have correct ways :)
suanji I am sorry missed ur question on his death date...... Dominick died Dec 9th 1932 in Dover, NH.

thanks again ! Carol
User avatar
Cassell
Newbie
Newbie
 
Posts: 21
Joined: 26 Sep 2004, 00:00

Re: Help finding area for surnames Cassell // Edmundi

Postby suanj » 29 Oct 2004, 22:08

Cassell wrote:hiya all :)
Yes he was quite a man to say the least lol. But it is wonderful of u all to be of such help to me in this and for that i am enternally grateful to u all ! Giving all ur help we are starting to narrow down area in Itally YEAHHHHH ! tytyty.
I think the misspelling of names, first and last on alot of this is simply in this day census takers, town records etc couldnt spell em and put it down as it sounded. But its from these records that I have come to spell em as i have till i have correct ways :)
suanji I am sorry missed ur question on his death date...... Dominick died Dec 9th 1932 in Dover, NH.

thanks again ! Carol

Hi Carol: I understand finally; Domenico Francesco married 2 time.. and many childrens.. I search in Italy and my attention is also on first name: are 2 first name: Domenico and Francesco that result 1 only first name.. this is frequent in Italy for many first name, but togheter Domenico and Francesco...well this particular not frequent in Italy and also is tipical of Campania region , Naples area.. the search in this time it leads to Campania region.. .. another request: you know... if, around emigration are already married with first wife ?
More: about various data of birth the most probable , perhaps, is 1863 why the marriage license was wrote from an priest and sure the priests are all exact....will be difficult to found something why are many version of Cassell surname in Italy.. but the search continue.....
suanj :wink:
User avatar
suanj
V.I.P.
V.I.P.
 
Posts: 11216
Joined: 20 Feb 2003, 01:00
Location: Molise region, Italy

Re: Help finding area for surnames Cassell // Edmundi

Postby Cassell » 29 Oct 2004, 23:50

suanj,
I believe he married in Rhode Island in 1900 he claimed he and Mary was married 23 years then that would bring marriage around 1877.
Giving he was named Domenico Francesco whos parents would he be named after Maria's or his Paschale's? I believe a while back i read somewhere on the naming of the kids was named from each of their parents.
Giving all different dates of birth he gives leaves me scratching my head lol. I do see what u mean tho about the date he gave to priest, but i dont see how or why in that day and age he would marry them in a catholic church giving they had 11 kids prior to marring. And on 2nd marriage liscense why he was claiming that to be his first marrage, said them (1929) he was 66 so that again brings it back to 1863. Guess it was easier for him to lie to census takers or maybe they misunderstood him.. very hard to say :( But 3 years later when he died he was said to be 60 on death report hmmmmmmm.

Carol :)
User avatar
Cassell
Newbie
Newbie
 
Posts: 21
Joined: 26 Sep 2004, 00:00

Re: Help finding area for surnames Cassell // Edmundi

Postby suanj » 30 Oct 2004, 05:52

Cassell wrote:suanj,
I believe he married in Rhode Island in 1900 he claimed he and Mary was married 23 years then that would bring marriage around 1877.
Giving he was named Domenico Francesco whos parents would he be named after Maria's or his Paschale's? I believe a while back i read somewhere on the naming of the kids was named from each of their parents.
Giving all different dates of birth he gives leaves me scratching my head lol. I do see what u mean tho about the date he gave to priest, but i dont see how or why in that day and age he would marry them in a catholic church giving they had 11 kids prior to marring. And on 2nd marriage liscense why he was claiming that to be his first marrage, said them (1929) he was 66 so that again brings it back to 1863. Guess it was easier for him to lie to census takers or maybe they misunderstood him.. very hard to say :( But 3 years later when he died he was said to be 60 on death report hmmmmmmm.

Carol :)

Dear Carol:
I have analyzed the data and frankly the discrepancies are many.

-Perhaps the first wedding was not a legal wedding, that is was only one union without ceremony.

This would explain many things.

Moreover between the born sons, analyzing the first names,
are that:

-there are two sons of name Peter(Pietro), borns in different years and this means that first Peter of years 14 in 1910 had to be died already in 1912 when born second Peter. ..it is use in Italy to renew the name of the dead sons.

-Therefore there are two Mary (Maria/Marian/Marianna and Mary), two John(Giovanni: first John and second John in 1914) etc..

-About the son Michael maiden name Robidoux born in 1915 are possible that really born in Canada, if Anna Robidoux came in Canada for parents visit, when pregnant..

-About the name of parents, Domenico Francesco, calls only a son born in 1917 , Pasquale. This means that the relationship with Pasquale sr father was not optimal in the past. Naturally are hypotheses based on acquaintance of the Italian culture.

-To help of such hypothesis are the fact that in 1919 is born a daughter to which the name of Mary is given, like the mother of Domenico. Therefore in these years (between 1917/1919) Domenico want to honor its parents.

-About various data on census etc, for my experience, I know che frequent are many errors... In Domenico Francesco's case, again analyzing all data, I believe that the different data are intentional... that are supplied erroneous for a reason, since is unthinkable that are these discrepancies only for chance causes ...

-Again for my experience, I believe that are necessary star the search assuming an sure data, the "sure " data most probable: the data in second marriage act. About this marriage (Domenico Francesco Cassel and Anna Robidoux) you have the certificate; now: are possible for you an request about the "process" of this marriage? Excuse my english, hoping clear, in all marriages, previous the cerimony are an process, that is preliminary papers conserved in the churh archives...You have possibilities of access to this "process"? For catholic marriage, all italians emigrated they demanded in Italy the birth act! This is sure... and sure also in 1929...

-Returning to the first union, my hypothesis that was not a legal wedding between Domenico Francesco and Mary, is helped also from second union: why the legal marriage with Anna Robidoux was in 1929, when all the children were already been born (in fact the last child, Annie died infant, was born in 1929).. this means that Domenico Francesco it was contrary to the legal union in past!

Well: for just start of search please that you search for "process" marriage (Cassel/Robidoux) in Church archive ...if you found are possible discover all....
I continue the search in Italy..
Many regards,
suanj
User avatar
suanj
V.I.P.
V.I.P.
 
Posts: 11216
Joined: 20 Feb 2003, 01:00
Location: Molise region, Italy

Re: Help finding area for surnames Cassell // Edmundi

Postby Cassell » 30 Oct 2004, 07:18

hiya suanj,
I will have to call the church back and ask if they got a birth act form. I will do that Mon. If this is so i see why u say the 1863 is most apt correct.
As for a few corrections / thoughts......
Canidians was very common for naming their kids of names of bible .. this could be why the dupilicate names its possible to do provided u give each a diifferent middle name, and here too its common after lost of that son to honor his name in another son.
About the son Michael maiden name Robidoux born in 1915 are possible that really born in Canada, if Anna Robidoux came in Canada for parents visit, when pregnant.. this is the correction..... Michael Maiden name was Cassell his middle name was Robidoux (after his mothers born name)
This means that the relationship with Pasquale sr father was not optimal in the past. (this i am sorry I didnt understand at all)
Also in the states many times they will give immergrants younger age to make it easier for them to find work.
Earlier I wrote to Rhode Island archive to see if they have any marriage or birth info on these family of Dominick and Mary.. Lets hope they write me back and can assist me in finding what area there he was and or any ifo to help :)

Carol
User avatar
Cassell
Newbie
Newbie
 
Posts: 21
Joined: 26 Sep 2004, 00:00

Re: Help finding area for surnames Cassell // Edmundi

Postby suanj » 30 Oct 2004, 10:25

Hi Carol: ok for all..
for this:
This means that the relationship with Pasquale sr father was not optimal in the past. (this i am sorry I didnt understand at all)

In italian family culture and in particular in the past time, to call the first son as the grand father(paternal line=Pasquale sr), was a obligation moral much great...when this did not happen the explanation was explicit: breach of relationships between father and son...(Pasquale sr and Domenico Francesco).
Waiting your news, many regards, suanj
User avatar
suanj
V.I.P.
V.I.P.
 
Posts: 11216
Joined: 20 Feb 2003, 01:00
Location: Molise region, Italy

Re: Help finding area for surnames Cassell // Edmundi

Postby suanj » 30 Oct 2004, 10:34

More: someone have possibilities of to control this data in

New York Passenger Lists, 1851-1891 by Ancestry.com

Bmenico* Casselli ??
*(Domenico misspelled)
Thanks, suanj
User avatar
suanj
V.I.P.
V.I.P.
 
Posts: 11216
Joined: 20 Feb 2003, 01:00
Location: Molise region, Italy

Perhaps....

Postby suanj » 30 Oct 2004, 15:28

an record interesting....
but first an suggestion;
- in new Hampshire and in maine I've found that , in years interested, was also Casale and Casillo surnames... Well, normally an emigrant it follows the traces of parents that are emigrated before.... and my hope was that the italian surname was wrote well...
Well: very very similar:
DOMENICO ANTONIO CASALE
Male


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Event(s):
Birth: 10 AUG 1857

Christening: 10 AUG 1857 Prata Sannita, Caserta, Italy

Death:
Burial:


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Parents:
Father: PASQUALE CASALE Family
Mother: MARIA IMUNDI

---------------------
In facts Imundi surname exist and are 10 families Imundi living in Prata Sannita.. not are currently nobody Casale person.. but are 135 families Commons of Caserta province...
for me this are an success... perhaps....
:lol: suanj
User avatar
suanj
V.I.P.
V.I.P.
 
Posts: 11216
Joined: 20 Feb 2003, 01:00
Location: Molise region, Italy

Re: Help finding area for surnames Cassell // Edmundi

Postby mfjp » 30 Oct 2004, 17:52

suanj, you truly are the best! Really good work! Still new at researching, and appreciate learning from you...

you wrote in an earlier post

"More: someone have possibilities of to control this data in

New York Passenger Lists, 1851-1891 by Ancestry.com

Bmenico* Casselli ??
*(Domenico misspelled)
Thanks, suanj "

O: Italy
O: 13 Jul 1891 Jul 1891 - New York
O: Le Havre, France
O: New York

age 38

I have the manifest... and I want to place a piece of the manifest into this post... I want you to take a look at a name on the top of the list... his name is Carlo "Inuamonti???".. maybe the other names on the list may help

How do I place a jpeg image into this post...?? anyone??...witht thanks mfjp
User avatar
mfjp
Master
Master
 
Posts: 2217
Joined: 13 Aug 2004, 00:00

PreviousNext

49 posts • Page 2 of 41, 2, 3, 4

Return to Italian Genealogy

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot], Majestic-12 [Bot] and 9 guests

Copyright © 2014. www.ItalianGenealogy.com.