italian name Leber

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Re: italian name Leber

Postby murse1973 » 27 Apr 2012, 23:44

its funny about his birth because his death certificate says italy, when he filled out the draft card in 1917, he put born in italy, but here is does say engleside wv, and i believe I found something else with missouri...I have no clue why there are different birth places..
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Re: italian name Leber

Postby pink67 » 28 Apr 2012, 08:36

I'm happy I was able to help you!

I believe this may have been the 1910 census for Marie Spatz and her sisters:

1910 United States Federal Census

Name: Marie Spatz
Age in 1910: 13
Birth Year: 1897
Birthplace: Ohio
Home in 1910: Cincinnati Ward 22, Hamilton, Ohio
Race: White
Gender: Female
Relation to Head of House: Inmate
Marital Status: Single
Father's Birthplace: Ohio
Mother's Birthplace: Ohio

http://postimage.org/image/uqw1aazr5/

Laura

p.s. memorial for Charles Roy Leber on the site Findagrave:

http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cg ... 08&df=all&
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Re: italian name Leber

Postby pink67 » 28 Apr 2012, 09:21

From Ancestry.com, frorm the "San Antonio express" the 1972 obit for Charles A Leber, unfortunately no place of birth is mentioned...

http://postimage.org/image/3kx0vsir1/

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Re: italian name Leber

Postby murse1973 » 28 Apr 2012, 17:06

hey laura,

that 1910 census of marie l spatz actually looks like she was in a group home for troubled women. It calls them inmates which is odd. I assume she was a troubled youth. From what I understand, when my grandmother was 2yrs old in 1934, she tried to burn the house down with my grandmother, marie rose leber and my uncle, kenneth leber in the house..she was never seen or heard from again. I am assume she had a mental illness or something because my grandmother suffered from depression and was diagnosed as bipolar.
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Re: italian name Leber

Postby pink67 » 28 Apr 2012, 17:46

Oh... what a sad story.. If we only could find Charles's family in the 1930 census maybe some other clues will jump up...
Charles Roy Leber was born on 17 october 1925 in St. Louis MO (as per the death certificate), died on 1939 in Pine Lawn, near St. Louis so they must have been living there on 1930. I'm unable to find that census...

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Re: italian name Leber

Postby suanj » 28 Apr 2012, 18:13

me too Laura.. I searched so much... as it is possible that cannot be found?? maybe he used another name?
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Re: italian name Leber

Postby vj » 28 Apr 2012, 20:26

I can't find 1930 census either

Checking records for Spatz in case Marie Spatz Leber moved back to Cinti

Found her father's record at Walnut Hills Cemetery

http://www.walnuthillscemetery.org/
Name: LOUIS P SPATZ Address: 1715 POWER ST. CINCINNATI Born: Date of Death: Apr 28, 1906 Age: 39 Reason: COLITIS Marital Status: M Spouse: Parents: Nearest Relative: WIFE Relative Address: Interment Number: Interment Date: Apr 30, 1906 Cemetery Location: Section: 23 Lot: Grave: 431 Row: 37 Marker: Funeral Director: MUNDELL & YUNGBLUTH Remarks: Disclaimer: This is the complete record on file at the cemetery of this burial. Any missing/incomplete information was not provided to the cemetery at the time of the burial and is not known by the cemetery.
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Re: italian name Leber

Postby vj » 28 Apr 2012, 20:52

Still no luck with 1930 or later census
Another clue? May have been named 'Alice' Marie Spatz
Valarie

From the University of Cinti
http://drc2.libraries.uc.edu/handle/123456789/371176

I'm pretty sure this is the index card to Marie Spatz's birth record
Using this file in the past, errors are not unusual
It's possible that her first name was Alice as shown on the card, or Louise as seen on the 1900 census
The birth date also matches the 1900 census
From another daughter's record, their mother was Barbara Vogel

Spatz, Alice
Born 18 Oct 1897
Female
White
Address: Powers Street
Father: Louisa (Louis P Spatz)
Mother: Barbara (Vogel)
Father's occupation: Tinner
Midwife: B Huber
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Re: italian name Leber

Postby suanj » 28 Apr 2012, 20:53

interesting find Valarie!
Hugs,
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Re: italian name Leber

Postby vj » 28 Apr 2012, 21:06

Hey suanj :D !
I've helped friends with their research in Cincinnati.
There are quite a few records online.

I wish we could answer the original question.
I think Charles Angelo Leber was born in Italy.
I don't think it would have been unusual for him to tell a census enumerator that he was born in West Virginia - there may not have been many Italians in St Louis.
Perhaps his first job was in West Virginia?

When it came to his military record he probably told the truth.
His town of birth is on his WWI card, but it's not clear.
I'm going to look for a clearer copy of his WWI Card on Family Search

I'm not sure where his WWII Card is.

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Re: italian name Leber

Postby vj » 28 Apr 2012, 21:33

Another copy of Charles Angelo Leber's WWI Card from FamilySearch
pg1
http://imageshack.us/a/img853/4493/cal1.jpg
pg2
http://imageshack.us/a/img14/3301/cal2i.jpg

born in Sagant (?) Italy
(the 'g' was written over another letter)
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Re: italian name Leber

Postby pink67 » 28 Apr 2012, 22:03

Great finds Valarie! :D

I believe that the next step now for the poster is to ask for the SSN application as you wrote...

From Familysearch.org this is a 1923 marriage record for Marie Spatz (Alice)'s sister:

Ohio, County Marriages, 1789-1994,

name: Elmer Pahner
titles & terms:
event: Marriage
event date: 16 Jun 1923
event place: Hamilton, Ohio
age: 21
birth date:
birthplace: Delhi, Ohio
marriage date note:
marriage place note:
estimated birth year: 1902
father: August Pahner
father's titles & terms:
mother: Lena Horlager
mother's titles & terms:
spouse: Louise Spatz
spouse's titles & terms:
spouse's age: 20
spouse's birth date:
spouse's birthplace: Cin., O.
spouse's estimated birth year: 1903
spouse's father: Louis Spatz
spouse's father's titles & terms:
spouse's mother: Barbara Vogel
spouse's mother's titles & terms:
reference number: v 334 cn 202
film number: 384181
digital folder number: 4016579
image number: 434

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/X8RV-8ZN

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Re: italian name Leber

Postby pink67 » 28 Apr 2012, 22:05

and possible marriage record for Louis P. Spatz?

Ohio, County Marriages, 1789-1994

name: Louis P. Spatz
titles & terms:
event: Marriage
event date: 12 Jan 1897
event place: Hamilton County, Ohio
age:
birth date:
birthplace:
marriage date note:
marriage place note:
estimated birth year:
father:
father's titles & terms:
mother:
mother's titles & terms:
spouse: Barbara Weller
spouse's titles & terms:
spouse's age:
spouse's birth date:
spouse's birthplace:
spouse's estimated birth year:
spouse's father:
spouse's father's titles & terms:
spouse's mother:
spouse's mother's titles & terms:
reference number: 206
film number: 344506
digital folder number: 4016411
image number: 140
Source Citation

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/T ... cc=1614804

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Re: italian name Leber

Postby vj » 28 Apr 2012, 22:50

Neat records Laura!
I agree, hopefully Chas Leber's SS Application has his town of birth (in Italy)
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Re: italian name Leber

Postby carinthiangirl » 29 Apr 2012, 09:15

Leber and Spatz are both german names.
Leber = lever
Spatz = sparrow
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haussperling
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