Advice Re: Italian Citizenship jure sanguine

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Advice Re: Italian Citizenship jure sanguine

Postby jmrossi » 17 Oct 2012, 20:40

Hi.

I wrote to this forum quite a while back, in preparation for my sister and my citizenship application and appointment at the consulate in NYC. The advice proved helpful, and I now have some more queries that I am hoping someone might be able to help me with. I am also writing in detail the update on my situation in hopes that it might be helpful to others who are going through this process.

Since I last wrote, I successfully acquired my great grandfather, Ernesto Rossi's birth certificate thanks to a last minute trip to Naples before my appointment at the consulate in July (the trip also cracked open a lot of new research about my ancestors that stayed in Italy, as well as a New York branch of the family that I had not met).

My appointment/screening of documents in July raised a few issues that I have to take care of, which meant that I had to make another appointment (not until September 10, 2013! - my birthday.)

There were three issues in total:
1. My mother's middle name, Antoinetta, is listed on my birth certificate as Antoinette (ending with an E). This proved to be a straightforward fix- to make a correction to my birth certificate ( and is forthcoming via mail)

2. The Naturalization Records for both of my great grandparents, Ernesto and his wife, Maria Rosa, which were acquired through the USCIS, do not have an 'oath page.' I contacted the USCIS to inquire why the documents sent were incomplete (according the Italian consulate). Their response was:

Please note that all Naturalization Certificate Files did not include an Oath of Allegiance. United States naturalization regulations of 1929 were the first to differentiate between the "substance of" and the "text of" the oath of renunciation and allegiance. The substance of the oath was found in each of several U.S. nationality laws dating from 1790. Yet not until 1906, when the federal government first began its effort to standardize naturalization procedures, was there any attempt to issue a uniform, printed text for the oath. A prescribed text was not officially adopted and promulgated until the late 1920's.

Because of this the printed Oath of Allegiance was not standard in the Naturalization Process and is not included in all naturalization Certificate Files. Please be assured that this office provided you with all of the documents that were included in each subject's Naturalization File and unfortunately there was no printed Oath of Allegiance. We apologize for any inconvenience that this has caused.


Is is possible that the Consulate does not know this? If so, how do I prove this to them, as they were pretty adamant that an oath page was required.

3. My wife is a Turkish Citizen who has acquired US citizenship through marriage. She does not plan to apply for Italian citizenship, and thus I did not bring any of her documents other than a copy of her Turkish passport and our Marriage Certificate. I was informed that even though she does not intend to apply, that I needed to submit her birth certificate as part of my application. My wife has since acquired an extract of her birth certificate stamped by the Turkish Consulate. This document is obviously in Turkish. Will I need to have it translated into both English and Italian for the application?

Finally, the last thing that I will need to take care of, is a translation of all US documents into Italian. I had not done so in preparation for the July appointment as it seems that I was misinformed that in the states of New York and Texas, that Italian consulates do the translations for you. At the time, I was using the website http://www.myitaliancitizenship.com/index.php as a resource. Please be advised that according to the NY Consulate website, all US documents need to be translated into English and they do not do this service for you. They do provide a list of approved translators.

I will be taking on the translation project come December, so if anyone can recommend anyone from the list that the consulate's website provides, that would be great. However, the more pressing concerns are items 2 & 3, listed above. Any advice is much appreciated.

Thanks,

Johnmichael Rossi
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Re: Advice Re: Italian Citizenship jure sanguine

Postby JCFV » 16 Mar 2013, 01:37

Hello-Your wife's birth certificate would be translated into Italian (if any of the translators can translate from Turkish directly to Italian) It is best to look at the Italian Consulate website that you are applying through, to see what they require. There are many sites out there re: Italian citizenship-so it can be confusing. This is the Italian Consulate-NYC website- list of translators: (the consulate doesn't translate the documents-but they have a list of suggested translators) http://www.consnewyork.esteri.it/Consol ... uttori.htm Once the translations are completed and you go for your visit in September-the consulate will "verify/legalize" the translated documents for you. There is a charge per page depending upon what the value of the Euro against the dollar is. They accept credit cards for payment. Regarding the Oath page- That can be obtained from the National Archives along with all of the naturalization documents (petition etc) You can order it online or via regular mail or in person at a local NARA site You would request a "certified" paper copy-which will have a red ribbon and gold seal on it with a 1/2/ page certifying the documents. I have sent for naturalization records from both the NARA and the USCIS and the NARA document includes the oath of Allegiance (the USCIS does not) https://eservices.archives.gov/orderonl ... chives.gov Click on "Order Reproductions" then click on "Immigration and Naturalization" then click on "Naturalization" then click on " Certified Paper copy -additionall $ 15) You will have to register an account with them with a username and password. Best of luck to you with the process.
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Re: Advice Re: Italian Citizenship jure sanguine

Postby JCFV » 19 Mar 2013, 02:10

PS If your great grandparenst naturalized before 1906-then the NARA will send you a "No record" letter
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Re: Advice Re: Italian Citizenship jure sanguine

Postby JCFV » 20 Mar 2013, 04:53

Hello-I *think maybe this is your great grandmother Rosa Maria Rossi's naturalization record(???) 1928- http://postimage.org/image/74eqm2abp/ and the "Oath of Allegiance " page : http://postimage.org/image/mgyhg39hh/full/ If this is your GGF Ernesto and wife Rosa in the 1920 census-(???) it indicates that he had submitted his "PA" Papers/petition for intent to naturalize- by the time the census was taken-(but was not naturalized "Na" yet as of that date-so his naturalization record (which would include the "Oath of Allegiance") should be in the NARA records : http://postimage.org/image/6gld9bntd/full/
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