Translation Confusion

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Translation Confusion

Postby sinatra101 » 18 Mar 2013, 15:41

Need help figuring this one out. The first link shows the mother of Vincenzo Botte as "Irene Sisto" married to Michele Botte. The second link shows the marriage of Angela Maria Sisto to Michele Botte? The third link shows her name as Maria Carmela Sisto? Can anyone help figure this out as to what is the right name?


https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/T ... n640958006

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/T ... 1566630114

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/T ... 1566630114
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Re: Translation Confusion

Postby erudita74 » 18 Mar 2013, 16:47

sinatra101 wrote:Need help figuring this one out. The first link shows the mother of Vincenzo Botte as "Irene Sisto" married to Michele Botte. The second link shows the marriage of Angela Maria Sisto to Michele Botte? The third link shows her name as Maria Carmela Sisto? Can anyone help figure this out as to what is the right name?


https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/T ... n640958006

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/T ... 1566630114

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/T ... 1566630114



The confusion between the marriage index and the actual marriage record is easy to explain. There were often errors in the indices. The father's name was Angelo (not Angela)Maria Sisto. Maria was often used as a first or middle name for men in a lot of the Italian records. The bride was Maria Carmela Sisto, his daughter. So the index has it wrong.

As to the discrepancy between the birth record and the marriage record, perhaps the marriage record is not for the couple listed as the parents in the birth record. First of all, in the marriage record, we have Michele Paolo as opposed to just Michele. The other thing is the discrepancy in the ages between the marriage and birth records. In the birth record, Michele is 36 and his wife Irene Sisto was age 30. In the marriage record, only 1 year earlier, he was 29 and she was 25. So the couple in the marriage record may be different people from the couple in the birth record. That is one possible scenario to consider. I also noticed in looking through the earlier marriage records that there are many indexes which are missing. So, if you relied solely on the indexes to locate the marriage record, you may have missed the record because the index is missing. Also, if you find Vincenzo Filomeno's marriage record, you may discover that there is a correction to his mother's name on that record.

Other than that, I really don't know what to tell you. Have you located other births to this couple to see what first names are on those records, or even their death records?

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Re: Translation Confusion

Postby kniuhart » 18 Mar 2013, 19:11

There is a strong possibility that neither of those 2 marriages are the "right" Michele Botte or the "right" Sisto -- even though all of the Bottes are stone-workers. (could be an ancestor Michele had several sons, all of whom named Their son Michele.....)
I Did find two more children born to the Same couple, Michele & Irene; in 1841 (#142) Giovanni Antonio Filomena & in 1843 (#234) Michelina Filomena Angela; the ages of the parents seem to be completely unreliable! In 1841, they are Both "30"; in 1843, Irene is 30 and Michele is 33. So, That will not help you at all in finding them.
The index is missing from some of the years, and the earliest part - i.e., containing the B's, which you need, is missing from one or more years.
The births seem to stop at 1843, which could mean: she died; or he died; or they were now too old to have children; or they moved. (If it was me, I would take the time to search the Morti indexes for at least five years to look for the death of either one.)
Looks like this will not be so simple!
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Re: Translation Confusion

Postby sinatra101 » 18 Mar 2013, 19:35

Thanks Erudita and Kniuhart. It does seem crazy with the marriages and and birth years. I'm probably going to lean towards the other 2 children born to "Michele & Irene" figuring that the ages are pretty much in error. Now to check the death dates, if possible.

Thanks, Frank
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Re: Translation Confusion

Postby kniuhart » 19 Mar 2013, 20:34

Another possible avenue of research. Look for marriages of other 2 children, see if in Padula; if so, the records should say della fu or del fu, if parents of "groom", etc. deceased (or despondo (sp.)) or possibly vivente if still alive. (It took me a while to figure that one out, with the help of several on this site.......)
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Re: Translation Confusion

Postby sinatra101 » 20 Mar 2013, 18:58

ok thanks
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