Are these people brothers? I'd like opinions

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eduz
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Are these people brothers? I'd like opinions

Postby eduz » 02 Aug 2014, 03:57

Hi there, first of all thanks for reading my post.

Bernardo and Andrea are presumibly the italian ancestors I've been looking for, for years.

Everything seems to match, but there is a questionable difference between their mother's last names.

Personally, I believe these baptism records belong to two brothers. But I cannot prove it 100%.

What do you think?

Image

Full image: http://oi59.tinypic.com/xposbt.jpg

carubia
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Re: Are these people brothers? I'd like opinions

Postby carubia » 02 Aug 2014, 08:00

I think it's very probable that these are the same woman. It's not uncommon to see a woman's surname vary in her children's records. It could be that one surname was this woman's father's surname and another her mother's. Or it could just be a mistake, since the names are similar.

But then it's possible that the first wife died and he remarried. Or even that this is a different man, but that seems pretty unlikely. One couldn't rule all these possibilities out entirely, without seeing other records. How common are these surnames in that town? Have you looked through indexes? Have you seen this couple's marriage record?

eduz
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Re: Are these people brothers? I'd like opinions

Postby eduz » 02 Aug 2014, 08:35

Hi carubia, thanks for replying.

I've spent hours browsing hundreds of records, those last names were relatively common at least in that location and time.

I couldnt find their marriage certificate because the period of time when they presumibly got married is not available in the "Archivo dello Stato di Genova".

I strongly believe that they are the same people, but I am not sure that Italian consulate will agree with me. :?

carubia
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Re: Are these people brothers? I'd like opinions

Postby carubia » 02 Aug 2014, 08:44

Why would you need to prove that 2 people are brothers for a jure sanguinis recognition case?

Which consulate? What is the line of descent that you would be using?

eduz
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Re: Are these people brothers? I'd like opinions

Postby eduz » 02 Aug 2014, 08:54

carubia wrote:Why would you need to prove that 2 people are brothers for a jure sanguinis recognition case?

Which consulate? What is the line of descent that you would be using?


Because I also found those two brother's death certificates in my country containing their mother's last name as "Canale".

The italian baptism certificate (Bernardo's) that gives me right to citizenship, unfortunately, shows his mother last name as "Canavaro", (see picture), but Andrea's is correct.

So... my intrincated plan is to prove that Bernardo and Andrea are brothers, by presenting their italian baptism certificates, and that are the same Bernardo and Andrea from the foreign death certificates, where everything (except from Geronima's last name) matches perfectly.

By proving that, I can demostrate that Canavaro last name is just an error.

carubia
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Re: Are these people brothers? I'd like opinions

Postby carubia » 02 Aug 2014, 09:12

I think the best course of action would be to get the comune to write a letter stating that they believe that this was the same woman, who went by both names. If you could get more records on her, such as her birth, marriage, or death cert, you could bolster that argument.

Then again, since your citizenship does not descend from her but rather her husband, a consulate may not be concerned about the discrepancy. It depends on where you apply.

eduz
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Re: Are these people brothers? I'd like opinions

Postby eduz » 02 Aug 2014, 09:19

I really appreciate your suggestions and I'll try to get more records linked to her.

Since now Italy is charging with 300 euro for just submitting the application, I am really hesitating about this issue, so I want to be sure.


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