CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grandfath

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CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grandfath

Postby LeeChristine » 29 May 2006, 11:34

Hi All

Here's hoping someone can assist in finding out the origins of my 4xg/grandfather Louis Bernard Salvatore Bregotti CHIOCCHI born somewhere in Italy c 1798 and emigrating to England c1820+. He was an artist in plaster / figure maker.

Accoring to the British censuses, he married a lady named Elizabeth (apparently born in Ireland) and had children: Lawrence 1826-1900, Louis Bernard (my direct ancestor) 1831-1903 and John 1833-1860- all born in England.

I have absolutely no idea when Louis aarrived in England or from where in Italy he hailed. Hopefully someone on this list can assist in that area. Also, does anyone know the origins of the name?

Thanks so much

Lee

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Re: CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grand

Postby suanj » 29 May 2006, 21:30

Lee I understand that you want know something about your ancestor, but 4 topics are no necessary, need only 1!

about Luigi Bernardo Salvatore Bregotti( mother surname for sure, but mistaken) CHIOCCHI, well because born in 1798 is a hero who can find it.. the registries start in north Italy abt 1871, and in south Italy abt 1809... we do't know the area of birthplace, because Chiocchi is a surname present in various italian regions ... you say that was a figure maker. he must be of Tuscany region, especially of Barga town , Camaiore town, Coreglia Antelminelli town.. it will be helpful to know the right Bregotti spell.. you have more info? regards, suanj
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Re: CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grand

Postby LeeChristine » 30 May 2006, 04:26

Thanks so much for the reply.

Firstly, please allow me to reassure you that the multiple postings were an accident and not an attempt to cause mayhem. Apologies for the inconvenience.

Bregotti / Bragotti are the only spellings I know for Louis. I have found him and the subsequent generations via the UK censuses and know a little of their life in Britain but I have no idea when Louis Chiocchi would have left Italy for either the UK / Ireland. However, other distant relatives chasing the same line seem to think Louis was originally was originally from Chioggia. Yes, Louis gave his occupation in the censuses as either artist, artist in plaster, or figure maker.

Thanks for your thoughts on my dilemma

Lee

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Re: CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grand

Postby wishyou » 30 May 2006, 04:45

"seem to think Louis was originally was originally from Chioggia"

I hope he didn't. Chioggia is an about 50.000 inhabitants town little south of Venice.
In this town are used surname and nickname!
Yes, the only town in Italy were nickname are officialy recognized by italian law as surname.
This means that, during various generations, surname could be changed various times (especially surname as Boscolo, Tiozzo, Penzo and Vianello) and researchs are almost impossibile

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Re: CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grand

Postby jcsm400 » 30 May 2006, 05:04

Hi Lee,

Have you gotten his death record? That & church records are good sources that may provide town of birth.

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Re: CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grand

Postby Marisa6 » 30 May 2006, 05:25

This is from the 1861 census - is this your family?

Ann Chiocchio abt 1829 Liverpool Wife Everton Lancashire
Ann G Chiocchio abt 1853 Liverpool Daughter Everton Lancashire
Elizabeth Chiocchio abt 1799 Mother Everton Lancashire
Katherine Chiocchio abt 1857 Liverpool Daughter Everton Lancashire
Louis Chiocchio abt 1798 Naturalized British Subject, Italy Father Everton Lancashire
Louis Chiocchio abt 1828 Liverpool Head Everton Lancashire
Louis Chiocchio abt 1861 Liverpool Son Everton Lancashire
Robert Chiocchio abt 1855 Liverpool Son Everton Lancashire


There is a Louis born 1798 who is a naturalised Brtitish citizen. There should be a record of that with more precise dates - but I'm not sure with it being so early. I'll keep looking

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Re: CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grand

Postby LeeChristine » 30 May 2006, 05:33

Yes, Marisa6

That family is mine. All the Chiocchi's in UK seem to be descended from either my Louis or his brother Lawrence. I know nothing of the other brother John or the sister Catherine (also born Ireland) - however, my maternal g/grandmother, Catherine Frances CHIOCCHI born 1887 Liverpool England, was named after her.

Alas, I have no idea of where to start looking for naturalisation records in England. The death certificate may yield something, you think?

Cheers

Lee

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Re: CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grand

Postby Marisa6 » 30 May 2006, 05:47

Hi Lee

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/fami ... ources.htm
usually would list naturalisation - but getting the spelling right might be a challenge. I have tried every variant I can think of on the 41 and 51 censuses to no avail :cry:

Ah well - I'm off to bed now - its ten to one here and my husband is grumbling!!

marisa
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Re: CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grand

Postby nuccia » 30 May 2006, 05:59

Hi Lee.

Here's another census (1851) I found that could be your family.

1851 England Census Recordinfo
about Louis Cheocchi
Name: Louis Cheocchi
Age: 53
Estimated birth year: abt 1798
Relation: Head
Household: View other family members
Gender: Male
Where born: Italy

Civil parish: Liverpool
Ecclesiastical parish: St Bartholomew
Town: Liverpool
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability:

View image

Source information: HO107/2178
Registration district: Liverpool
Sub-registration district: Howard Street
ED, institution, or vessel: 1w
Folio: 669
Page: 15 (click to see others on page)
Household schedule number: 60
GSU Number: 87175-87176

http://img187.imageshack.us/img187/578/imagex6ns.gif

Still looking...

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Re: CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grand

Postby Marisa6 » 30 May 2006, 20:52

Hi again

Following Nuccias inspired spelling suggestion where she found them in Liverpool, here they are on the 1841 census!


Catharine Cheochi abt 1826 Ireland Manchester Lancashire
Elizabeth Cheochi abt 1801 Ireland Manchester Lancashire
John Cheochi abt 1830 Lancashire, England Manchester Lancashire
Lawrence Cheochi abt 1826 Lancashire, England Manchester Lancashire
Lewis Cheochi abt 1801 Foreign Parts Manchester Lancashire
Lewis Cheochi abt 1827 Lancashire, England Manchester Lancashire


Its looks like Louis might have died between the 1861 and 1871 censuses - unless anyone has had any better luck than me finding him after 1861! This looks like a death listing for Elizabeth

Elizabeth Chioichi abt 1802 1877 Oct-Nov-Dec West Derby Lancashire


I'm not sure if an English death certificate will list the parents names - I really only know about Scottish certs which are very different. Maybe an English forum member could help there. Louis and Elizabeth married pre-1937, which will make finding their marriage lines a bit more challenging. You might need to find the church record. This webpage has a collection of articles on, questions about and examples of the work of Liverpool Italians. Look under the article on the ‘Cook St Mosaic’ and click on the little italy link. http://www.scottiepress.org/main.htm

Forum member Mahart is a Liverpool Italian – he might be able to help. There is also a good webpage on Manchester Italians here http://www.ancoatslittleitaly.com/

I'll keep looking too :D

Marisa
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Re: CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grand

Postby Marisa6 » 30 May 2006, 20:55

This might be his death - which would give a timeframe and area fro a death cert

Louis Bernard Chof__N abt 1807 1879 Oct-Nov-Dec Bristol Avon, Gloucestershire
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Re: CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grand

Postby suanj » 30 May 2006, 21:50

LeeChristine wrote:Thanks so much for the reply.

Firstly, please allow me to reassure you that the multiple postings were an accident and not an attempt to cause mayhem. Apologies for the inconvenience.

Bregotti / Bragotti are the only spellings I know for Louis. I have found him and the subsequent generations via the UK censuses and know a little of their life in Britain but I have no idea when Louis Chiocchi would have left Italy for either the UK / Ireland. However, other distant relatives chasing the same line seem to think Louis was originally was originally from Chioggia. Yes, Louis gave his occupation in the censuses as either artist, artist in plaster, or figure maker.

Thanks for your thoughts on my dilemma

Lee

abt Chioggia... in all Veneto region( Chioggia is in Venezia province in veneto region) well currently living only 2 Chiocchi persons... no, I don't think that your ancestor coming from Chioggia.. the profession is tipical of the town that i mentioned above perhaps it will be some other town with people especialized in figure making... but the area is right and I'm no in error.. also abt Bregotti...for the right spell we must read the handwriting, just for right reading... regards, suanj
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Re: CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grand

Postby suanj » 30 May 2006, 21:57

however my main idea is that your ancestor came from Camaiore town..... or Barga, or Lucca or near.......also are in this area the Begotti( no Bregotti) surname, Bigotti, and Bersigotti.... very similars your Bregotti...
in 1881 Uk census are:
Salvatone BIGOTTI Household (Salvatore!)
Male

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Other Information:
Birth Year <1830>
Birthplace Italy
Age 51
Occupation Sculptor & Modeller
Marital Status U <Unmarried>
Head of Household Salvatone BIGOTTI
Relation Head
Disability

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Source Information:
Dwelling 95 Islington Row
Census Place Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Family History Library Film 1341870
Public Records Office Reference RG11
Piece / Folio 3633 / 81
Page Number 20
------------------------------
the same(+ or -) profesiion your ancestor......
here are a member, Incipit nick, that have many records of Tuscany, he can help you... best regards, suanj
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Re: CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grand

Postby Marisa6 » 30 May 2006, 23:33

Hmm - found this on the English National Archives site.

Covering dates 1836 Oct 12
Scope and content Coach ticket, issued by Luigi Chechi, from Florence to Rome via Sienna.
Access conditions Normal Closure before FOI Act: 30 years
Closure status Open Document, Open Description
Held by National Gallery Libraries and Archive

As Suanj said - Luigi would have been Louis 'Italian' name. This is a record of a coach ticket - or it may be the coach ticket itself. As you can see it goes from Florence to Rome via Sienna, which if it is Louis' gives an idea where he came from

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Re: CHIOCCHI: Name Origins & the origins of my 4xg/grand

Postby suanj » 31 May 2006, 00:29

Hi marisa Chechi is another italian surname... I believe that cannot be he... however i'm most sure that was a tuscanian people.. perhaps incipit that have many civil records of Tuscany can help in the search............
Tommaso dove sei? Tommaso where are you?
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