Ancestors from Formia and Rome

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pogeybait
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Ancestors from Formia and Rome

Postby pogeybait » 02 Aug 2006, 08:49

Hello all,

My great-grandparents Alfredo Jacolenne (b. 1892) and Giuseppa (maiden: Punzo, b. 1897) arrived at Ellis Island in 1910, accompanied by Giuseppa's father Angelo Punzo (b. 1866). I have the Ellis Island manifest of their arrival.

The Punzos were from Formia, Italy whereas Alfredo was from Rome. I am using ICGS service to find the birth certificates of Alfredo and Giuseppa in these places, but I am still interested in finding the following:

1. We believe Alfredo and Giuseppa were married in early 1910, just prior to their departure for the USA. This probably occured in/near Formia, but perhaps Rome or Naples (Naples was point of departure). Are their any resources to search for their marriage certificate? They were practicing Catholics.

2. I would love to find baptismal records on both Alfredo and Giuseppa. Again, are their any places/people/organizations that would help me search for this information?

Thanks for your help and time!

Sincerely,

ZA Scott

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Re: Ancestors from Formia and Rome

Postby mfjp » 02 Aug 2006, 11:15

It's weird how Alfredo and and Giuseppa are listed as single people... :? :!: But is does mention that Alfredo's father in law is listed on line 7.... (Giuseppa's father...)

Also... shouldn't she have been listed as a 13 year old on the manifest?

1910 Manifest page 1

Page 2
First Name: Giuseppa
Last Name: Punzo
Ethnicity: Italy, Italian South
Last Place of Residence: Formia, Caserta
Date of Arrival: Jun 10, 1910
Age at Arrival: 17y Gender: F Marital Status: S
Ship of Travel: Neckar
Port of Departure: Naples
Manifest Line Number: 0008

First Name: Alfredo
Last Name: Tacolame
Ethnicity: Italy, Italian South
Last Place of Residence: Formia, Caserta
Date of Arrival: Jun 10, 1910
Age at Arrival: 18y Gender: M Marital Status: Single
Ship of Travel: Neckar
Port of Departure: Naples
Manifest Line Number: 0011

Maria

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Re: Ancestors from Formia and Rome

Postby wldspirit » 02 Aug 2006, 11:15

The Later Day Saints Library provides a number of available microfilms for research covering a wide range of records sources:

http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Library ... umns=*,0,0

Records are in Italian and the Lds provides a genealogy word list for this purpose.
http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Search/ ... Italia.ASP
To find a library near you use the following link:
http://www.familysearch.org/Eng/Library ... et_fhc.asp
wldspirit

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Re: Ancestors from Formia and Rome

Postby mfjp » 02 Aug 2006, 13:17

Need opinions here

See line 11... on page 1 of manifest linked above...

Any ideas as to what the surname should be... ?? I am not reading Jacolenne at all...

Maria

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Re: Ancestors from Formia and Rome

Postby suanj » 02 Aug 2006, 14:48

the name is wrote Jacolenne... and the phrase "son in law of n. 7" (Punzo) mean that was already married, but on Giuseppa he seem single... a error sure... the Alfredo birthplace is ROMA town right... however the better thing is to ask the birthrecord of Giuseppa, where are the marriage note and so also exact spelling of Alfredo surname, the father seem is Luigi Jacolenne (?) in Italy exist Jacolino/Iacolino in various version; in lazio region:
Iaconelli
Iacoella
Iacovelli
Iacomelli
etc...
with J initial:

Jaconelli
and I believe that this is right, and the surname is wrote with inverted the final part: Jaconelli is a surname of Roma
regards, suanj
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Re: Ancestors from Formia and Rome

Postby mfjp » 02 Aug 2006, 17:37

Hi suanj... thank you for looking at the surname...

It just didn't look right to me... I thought it was Iaconelli at first... but the more I stared at it ... the more it looked like Jacolenne...

I took a look at the 1920 census.. and she may have really been about 14 when she married and had her first child... but on her boat record, she says she is older...

I'm sure the poster may know more...

Maria

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Re: Ancestors from Formia and Rome

Postby suanj » 02 Aug 2006, 17:51

yes maria your surname intuition is very intelligent; I found this same error ( inversion of last letters of surname) in various ship's manifest, but is normal, because the people, the officer, don't knew the italian spelling, and this error is normal in the child in the first month of elementary school... I believe, just a my thought, that is very strange that a wife as Giuseppa, no travelling with the husband, but with the father.. I believe that they make the classic "fuitina"= love's escape... the age is so right for a love escape! however the better thing is to ask the birthact of Giuseppa, to reasd the Alfredo surname right spelling, and after to start in Roma the search for Alfredo civil records....
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Re: Ancestors from Formia and Rome

Postby pogeybait » 02 Aug 2006, 22:48

Hello,

Thank you all for your efforts and information. I really appreciate it.

The Ellis Island records are strange, as you found on your own. One thing I can tell you is that Giuseppa (my great-grandmother) was 3 months with her first child when she went through Ellis Island. And yes, she was only 13, but turned 14 before the child was born. I speculate that Giuseppa and her father made no mention of Alfred when they were questioned at Ellis Island. Alfred came in line a few people later and I think he mentioned he was "il marito," and perhaps that's when the clerk made the notations you mentioned.

We suspect, because of this pregnancy, that they had some sort of shotgun wedding in/near Formia before they came to the States.

The Jacolenne name is odd, yes? The only Jacolenne I've ever heard of from this family that remained in Italy was one of Alfred's nieces. She lived in Genova and wrote a relative of mine a letter in 1984. On that letter she spells her name as "Adelina Jacolenne." This makes me think that even when Alfred and his parents were living in Italy (1890-1910) they went by Jacolenne. However, the alternate surnames you have provided will be invaluable if my initial search using "Jacolenne" doesn't turn anything up.

One thing I don't understand - you suggest I find Giuseppa's birth certificate and use that to find the correct spelling of Alfred's surname. Is this suggesting that her birth certificate would later have marriage information added to it? I am also going to try to look for their marriage certificate but it will be hard I think.

Thanks again!
ZA Scott

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Re: Ancestors from Formia and Rome

Postby jcsm400 » 03 Aug 2006, 00:21

Thought you maybe interested in these websites>


Official website of the comune di Formia.

http://www.comune.formia.lt.it/portaleformia/index.php

If you don't read Italian, you may want this site...not the best translation but will do.
http://babelfish.altavista.com/


Info on Formia & some beautiful pictures.

http://www.italyworldclub.com/lazio/latina/formia.htm


From the 1st one, you can request birth, marriage & death atcs.

jcsm
Researching in San Vitaliano, Napoli, Italy & Armento, Potenza, Italy.

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Re: Ancestors from Formia and Rome

Postby suanj » 03 Aug 2006, 01:37

One thing I don't understand - you suggest I find Giuseppa's birth certificate and use that to find the correct spelling of Alfred's surname. Is this suggesting that her birth certificate would later have marriage information added to it? I am also going to try to look for their marriage certificate but it will be hard I think.

Yes, you make the request of Giuseppa birthact.. in this document you will find the right surname also of Alfredo and date of marriage..! regards, suanj
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Re: Ancestors from Formia and Rome

Postby mfjp » 04 Aug 2006, 10:10

Sorry I've been away... the heat wave made it impossible for me to sit infront of my computer... (long story)... plus one of my kids managed to destroy my system (again)... where at this point... we thought it would be best to just throw every "k" of info right out and start all new...

The others who helped you here have given great links and info...

Here' another

Italian form letters

http://www.circolocalabrese.org/resourc ... /index.asp

That manifest sure painted a picture eh? It must have been hard for all involved.

I certainly hope you can find the Marriage Act of Alfredo and Giuseppa.. it could certainly pinpoint what town Alfredo came from.

No known siblings for Alfredo??

1920 Census info.. (see viewable file below)

Name Parent or spouse names Home in 1920 (City, County,State) Estimated Birth Year BirthPlace Race Relation

Alfred Jacolenne Josephine Canton Ward 4, Stark, Ohio abt 1893 Italy White Head

Josephine Jacolenne Alfred Canton Ward 4, Stark, Ohio abt 1897 Italy White Wife

Julius Jacolenne Alfred, Josephine Canton Ward 4, Stark, Ohio abt 1911 Pennsylvania White Son

Aristide Jacolenne Alfred, Josephine Canton Ward 4, Stark, Ohio abt 1913 Pennsylvania White Son

Adeline Jacolenne Alfred, Josephine Canton Ward 4, Stark, Ohio abt 1915 Pennsylvania White Daughter

---------------
1920 census
----------------

Maria

Further... since they named their first born Julius... I thought I'd look for a boat record anyways and found this one.... (wasn't Alfredo's father named Luigi??)

Giuliano...?

First Name: Giulio
Last Name: Jacolencai
Ethnicity: U.S.A.; Italy S.
Last Place of Residence:
Date of Arrival: Jun 07, 1905
Age at Arrival: 38y Gender: M Marital Status: M
Ship of Travel: Cretic
Port of Departure: Genoa
Manifest Line Number: 0025

Just thought the surname was unique... no idea who he is....
------------------------

Name: Julius Jacolenne
SSN: xxxxxxxxxx
Last Residence: 43701 Zanesville, Muskingum, Ohio, United States of America
Born: 15 Dec 1910
Died: Dec 1968
State (Year) SSN issued: Ohio (1952-1953 )

Maria

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Re: Ancestors from Formia and Rome

Postby pogeybait » 07 Aug 2006, 04:39

Hello, thanks for the additional information.

Alfred had 2 brothers, Julius and Luigi. Luigi remained in Italy and had a daughter Adelina who lived in Genova. I mentioned above a letter I had received, it was from her in 1984 and that is the last we hear of her and that part of the family.

In this letter she mentions that Julius "went to the first war and after that nobody knows anything about him." The Ellis Island record you sent me for Giulio could very well be him - perhaps this family had more roots in Genova than Rome (Alfredo's birthplace) as this fello came from Genova as well.

Finally, the record you found of Julius in Zanesville OH is actually the first son of Alfredo, presumably named after Alfred's brother. He also shows up in that 1920 census record you posted.

I'm waiting to hear back from my ICGS search for Alfredo and Giuseppa's birth certificates. If that doesn't work I will contact Suanj to contract her services.

Thank you kindly!


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