Information about Brogio & Broggio surnames

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Information about Brogio & Broggio surnames

Postby cbrogio » 02 Apr 2003, 19:50

Can anyone tell me how I can find information about Broggio and Brogio surnames . I am looking for a birth certificate of my ancestor that emigrated to Brazil about 1896 Alessandro Brogio and he was born in 1865 in the Veneto area and married with Marieta Trombini but I don`t know the city of birth.How can I obtain the exact information of the date and place of birth in “ liste di leva” of “Arquivio di Stato” di Padova , Rovigo , Verona e Venezia.They do this research for me?If they are unable to do this research for me , are there some local researchers .
Any help in finding a Birth Certificate for this person would be greatly appreciated.

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Postby ptimber » 02 Apr 2003, 22:03

Do you know which province he came from? Birth and marriage records are usually in the city or town of origin and if her served in the army his records would be released after 75 to the public in the Provincial archives. Both Brogio and Broggio are two separate surnames and there are 10 Brogio and 124 Broggio in Veneto region. There are 9 Brogio in Padova province and 1 in Vicenza province and Broggio is located in all 7 provinces. Your request for hiring someone is not going to do you anything good since you have no information for them!!. May I suggest you start in your end in Brazil ands go to www.imigrantesitalianos.com.br and also go to the Family histoiry library of the Mormon church and see if you can look up any record for your grndfather. But what is most important is what is his name and surname since Brogio and Broggio are two different surnames. I will try to see if he came into Argentina first but their records do not show the place of origin only a date of arrival. Peter NYC

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Postby ptimber » 02 Apr 2003, 22:22

The argentina records reflect that an AMBROGGIO BROGGIO (I presume the first name is in error and probably when they asked his first name he gave them his last name and they just put it down anyway as a first name). arrived in Buenos Aires on July 28, 1887 at age 21 which means he was born in 1866 or 1867 depenfing on his birthdate. Since this is the only record it may be him but there is no way to confirm this except if you write to the Centro de Estudios Migratores Latinoamericano (CEMLA), Calle Independencia 20, 1099 Capital Federal, Buenos Aires, Argentina. You can ask them for a copy of his immigration record and any record of his stay in Argentina....IF THATS HIM???, Also try www.fratellanza.org.br and www.rootsweb.com/~brawgw and www.genealogia.com.br.......But most of all you must go into your family oral history..alll the stories andall the pieces of paper, phbotograpsh anyting to find the town of origin ..any old letters any church names, feast days ANYTHING to find the province or the town. Peter NYC

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Postby ptimber » 02 Apr 2003, 23:00

For your information the person Ambroggio Broggio who entered on July 28,1887 on the UMBERTO I which sailed out of Genova. He was single and 21 years of age. Peter

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Postby cbrogio » 03 Apr 2003, 16:22

Peter, Thanks for your information .My ancestry surname is Brogio.In my reseach Brogio and Broggio surnames are in the same cities .I know Broggi surname is derived from Ambrogio then I concluded that Broggio and Brogio is same surname.Is that correct?

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Postby ptimber » 03 Apr 2003, 17:02

NO they are two separate names and are both listed in the Italian surname dictionary separately. Both are derived from the base name ambrogi. Your not going to get away that easy!!!!!!!!!!!. Peter

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Postby ptimber » 03 Apr 2003, 17:30

There are two FIRST NAMES in Italy and they are AMBROGIO and AMBROGINO. These are the oficial listings of first names in Italy but that does not mean that other first names with different spelling of the same base name Ambrogio does not exist. Remebner we are talking here of FIRST names now. Peter NYC

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Postby cbrogio » 04 Apr 2003, 19:31

Thanks Peter. I saw in Ellis Island a person Giovanni Brogio arrived in 1912 from Montescheno and hi father`s name is Luigi Broggio in the register.Is that a graphical error? Cleide Brogio.

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Postby ptimber » 04 Apr 2003, 21:18

The father Luigi Broggio resided in Lyon France and the son Giovanni came fromMontescheno, Italy. It is easy to conceive that an error could occur in France since the son's birth would have had to be declared by the son's father or by notary executed by the father or a male family members and the surname was Brogio. Documents of this nature are more serious in Italy. The father went to France and for whatever reason or error his name was transposed to Boggio. Peter NYC

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Postby ptimber » 05 Apr 2003, 01:27

The thought occurs to me that if you started your research knowing what you know and working backwards from Brazil (I gave you several websites to start off with) to Italy then you will either prove, disprove or become more frustrated in that order!!! but at least you will get somewhere. Obviously your hypothesis that Brogio and Broggio are one and the same is erroneous from the official standards already established. So why waste your time?? Peter NYC

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Postby cbrogio » 07 Apr 2003, 03:36

Peter, the problem is that I already researched here in practically many sites and places in Brazil. I went to the national File (www.arquivonacional.gov.br) in Rio de Janeiro (I live in São Paulo-SP to 450Km from Rio) where they have the microfilms and documents and manifestos of the vapors that arrived in Rio de Janeiro and people with destination to Minas Gerais (that is the case of my ancestral) , and this immigration was motivated and financed by the government from Minas Gerais from 1894 to 1897. The National File is not computerized and there are a lot of gaps of years . In the registers, the information are for instance minimum not containing the origin city. There are registers computerized for São Paulo, Espírito Santo and South of Brazil but not for Minas Gerais. The registers of the registry office of Minas Gerais and parish (city of Nepomuceno-MG of my ancestral ) are terrible. I got the whole documentation of my ancestors but the registers don't contain the date of birth nor the origin city with errors in the names and surnames. For instance in the register I know Alessandro Brogio's and Marieta Brogio’s parents :
Parents of Alexandre Brogio: Guisepe Brolio and Maria Brogio
Parents of Marieta Trombini: Guisepe Moni and Joana Guimen
Like you can see Marieta Trombini's parents last names are not Trombini . In the registry office a register of death of Marieta Brogio exists in 1961 and 86 years old and her parents are Giusepe Trombini and Dionísia Trombini and I think it belongs to Marieta Trombini. Up to 1938 the immigrants were not forced to be registered. After 1938 a law forced this registrations for who had less than 60 years old. Who had more than 60 years old was not forced and therefore Alessandro with 73 years old and Marieta with 63 years old in 1938 didn't make the registration. And also many Italians hid their nationalities for several reasons and they avoided to talk about Italy.
There are the following problems here in Brazil:
1 - many immigrants didn't make their registrations in the arrival in that time
2 - when the registration exists, or it is incomplete or deficient
3 - computerized registers almost inexistent in Brazil in this area
4 - fear of many Italians in saying their nationalities
5 - many of these immigrants were simple people and many times illiterate even to spell their names.
6 - my alive relative don't keep dates and facts with a lot of precision due to age (83 years old) .
7 - registers in the registry offices and Parishes are deficient and incomplete information
I am still researching (I maintain a researcher here in Brazil) in the registry office but the information that I need as place and exact date of birth of Alessandro Brogio to get his registration of Baptism I think I won't get here in Brazil for the mentioned difficulties. In the page of "Veneti nel Mondo" in "origini" they suggest that the person makes the research in "Archivio di Stato" and they gives an example : in the Archivio di Padova and "Liste di Leva” a person got the exact date and the city of his ancestral .I am trying to obtain some information in these military registers cause they have more complete information.Here in Brazil you can believe that I am trying the maximum. Now I need information to research in the military registrations of Italy. Cleide Brogio.

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Postby ptimber » 07 Apr 2003, 04:07

No problem. Do you want the address for each province or any specific province in the Veneto region for military records??? Peter

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Postby cbrogio » 26 Apr 2003, 22:17

Hi , Peter.Could you tell me please, the site in internet that can give me all addresses of civil registration office in all comunes of Verona and Rovigo?Cleide Brogio

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Postby ptimber » 26 Apr 2003, 23:53

Since you say all the comunes of both provinces , your talking about a goodly number to write to. The address is always headed by UFFICIO DI STATO CIVILE, Comune ..........., postale#..........., Provincia........, Regione Veneto, Italy

The website that is the most efficient for each comune in both provinces iswww.poste.it/online/cercacap. when the site appears fillin the line marked #1 with the province you are interested in and then click the arrown beneath and a listing of all the comunes in that province will appear with the relevant postal codes.

Please let me know if yoiu need any further assistance. Peter

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Postby ptimber » 27 Apr 2003, 22:41

The site is more correct with this www.poste.it/online/cercacap/privati. Peter


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