Advice for newbie please

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gennattasio
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Advice for newbie please

Postby gennattasio » 24 Aug 2007, 17:14

Salve a tutti!
I have 2 sets of great grandparents all born in Italy who immigrated to the U.S. and lived in Manhattan. I have not been successful in discovering anything about their arrivals, naturalisation or what regions in Italy they came from. All the birth, marriage and death certs I have only state Italy as their place of origin. Great grandparents were: Maria married to Francis both born around 1871-1872, immigrated around 1890. Also: Frank married to Francis, only know Francis was born around 1878.
I'm new to this forum and would appreciate some advice on where to go from here.

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rfornal
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Re: Advice for newbie please

Postby rfornal » 24 Aug 2007, 19:42

How far have you searched, what resources?

Have you used the http://stephenmorse.org/ to access the Ellis Island records?

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vj
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Re: Advice for newbie please

Postby vj » 24 Aug 2007, 20:08

Sometimes one confirmed record may lead to more records.
Could this be your family in Manhattan in 1920?
(note: names/ages may be off a bit)
Thanks! Valarie

from ancestry.com (paid subscription site)
(click here) interesting 1920 census
page 2
Home in 1920:
329 East 11th Street, rents
Manhattan Assembly District 8, New York, New York

head Francis Ferrara 49 (abt 1871) IT
- immig 1891 Na (naturalized)
- laborer
wife Mary Ferrara 47 (abt 1873) IT
- immig 1891 Na
children all born in NY
daughter Frances Ferrara 18
- finisher, garment
daughter Anna Ferrara 16
- finisher, garment
daughter Margaret Ferrara 14
daughter Mildred Ferrara 11
son Alfred Ferrara 9
daughter Edith Ferrara 5 8/12
---

Same family in 1910?
1910 census
Home in 1910:
331 East 11th Street, rents
Manhattan Ward 17, New York, New York

head Frank Ferraro 40 (abt 1870) IT
- married 21 years (abt 1889)
- immig 1891 Na
- ash cart, city
wife Maria Ferraro 37 (abt 1873) IT
- 10 children born, 9 children living
- immig 1891
children all born in NY
daughter Lena Ferraro 17
- paste labels, cigar box? factory
daughter Philamiana Ferraro 15
- paste labels, cigar box? factory
son Tonie Ferraro 14
daughter Lessie Ferraro 12
daughter Louise Ferraro 10
daughter Vincent? Ferraro 9
daughter Annie Ferraro 6
daughter Maggie Ferraro 4
daughter Millie Ferraro 1 6/12
---

Same family in 1900?
1900 census
Home in 1900:
314 Mott Street, rents
Manhattan, New York, New York

head Frank Ferro 30 (Apr 1870) IT
- married 9 years (abt 1891)
- immig 1890, in US 10 yrs, Na
- saloon porter
wife Mary J Ferro 26 (Jun 1873) IT
- 5 children born 5 children living
- immig 1890, in US 10 yrs
children all born in NY
daughter Payulunia Ferro 7 (June 1892)
daughter Mannie Ferro 6 (? 1894)
son Toney Ferro 4 (? 1896)
daughter Gressa Ferro 2 (Mar 1898)
daughter Sussie Ferro 4.12 (Feb 1900)
father Pasquale Ferro 70 (Jan1830) IT
- married 50 yrs (abt 1850?)
- immig 1890, in US 10 yrs, Al (alien)
mother Taessa r Ferro 62 (Jan 1838) IT
- 4 children born, 3 children living
- immig 1890, in US 10 yrs

note: another 'Ferro' family at same address
---

If these 3 census records are for the same family,
best guess as to children names:
Pasqualina/Lena abt 1892-1893 NY
Filomena/Mamie abt 1894-5 NY
Tony abt 1896 NY
Teresa/Tessie (Tressa) abt 1898 NY
Louise (Sussie) abt 1900 NY
Frances (Vincent) abt 1901-2 NY
Anna/Annie abt 1904 NY
Margaret/Maggie abt 1906 NY
Mildred/Millie abt 1909 NY
Alfred abt 1911 NY
Edith abt 1914 NY

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Re: Advice for newbie please

Postby Essgee » 25 Aug 2007, 00:02

Great job, vj

This might be the passenger manifest:

http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/6497 ... amijl1.jpg

The name might originally have been Giannattasio...found in Salerno and Avellino along with the Ferrara name.

No doubt, the naturalization papers and declaration of intent will provide additional information about your family...including town of origin.

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Re: Advice for newbie please

Postby vj » 25 Aug 2007, 01:39

Hey Essgee!
What a great manifest - I'm so glad you found it :D !
If this isn't gennattasio's family, hopefully the
information will help someone else :wink: .
You're right about the Gennattasio surname, it is
unique to only a few records on ancestry.com.
Was hoping for a few hits on IGG, but parts of the
site are down...
Thanks for jumping in on this one, that manifest was
tough.
Valarie
---

A bit more on essgee's wonderful manifest find:

Ship Name: Burgundia
Arrival Date: 25 Apr 1892
Port of Departure: Naples, Italy
Port of Arrival: New York, New York
Line: 81-84
Microfilm Serial: M237 Microfilm Roll: M237_586

Francesco Ferraro 22 (abt 1869-1870)
moglie (wife) Mariagnese 19 (abt 1872-1873)
Pasquale Ferraro 69 (abt 1822-3)
moglie (wife) Rosamaria 60 (abt 1831-2)

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Re: Advice for newbie please

Postby gennattasio » 25 Aug 2007, 04:24

SIETE GRANDE, GENEROSI, INCREDIBILE!!! I'm only able to write now because seeing all of your responses has been overwhelming and made me remember things I had forgotten. Grazie mille.
Yes VJ, the first family you listed is mine. .
Essgee, I don't know how you found this but it seems correct. What port was that in New York? I had searched the online Ellis Island and Castle Garden sites. .
Rfornal, I guess I am not very far at all even though I've been searching for almost 2 years. .
I found this forum by chance and never expected to have such a generous response. I had just talked with my friends in Italy and told them it may not be possible for me to continue any further with my quest. They were sad about this news because they are also looking for lost family who went to Argentina.
I appreciate anything you can tell me to do. Grazie amici per la speranza, grazie tantissimo.

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Re: Advice for newbie please

Postby Essgee » 25 Aug 2007, 14:56

Gennattasio......

I found the record by looking for Ferrara arrivals from 1890 to 1892. Anybody that arrived prior to 1892 didn't come through Ellis Island...so I looked at Ancestry and asked for all Francesco Ferr* born 1871 plus or minus two years arriving 1891 plus or minus two years. Then I just started going through the list of possibles.

It is unusual to have a wife listed under the husbands surname, but it did happen from time to time. When I saw the father's name Pasquale, I remembered the posting of Pasqualina as the first daughter. Seemed to make sense.

I am fairly confident that the Peter Ferro listed on the same page with Francesco's family is his brother. The first daughter appears to be named for Rosa, the grandmother. VJ did a fine job of tracking them all down.

If you can find the naturalization papers for Francesco, you should get additional information on town of origin etc. That will help you fill in the blanks.

And never give up in genealogy.....there are no real brick walls, only imagined ones. Often the problem results from a question not asked at the right time, in the right place, of the right people. You always have to keep asking new questions in different ways. We often forget that in order to get different results, we must often re-think the original question.

Good luck to you and let everyone here know how it goes.

And who are they looking for in Argentina? There are some sites now available that can help. It is harder to access then USA records, but tell your family and friends to post the info..never know what they can find.

Also, many ships to South America stopped on the way in NY or leaving South America stopped in NY before returning to Italy. Ellis Island lists many people in transit. Worth a shot!

Now, what else can you tell us about Frank Condo and wife? Where did they live? What are the names of the kids? Then we might be able to track them back as well.

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Re: Advice for newbie please

Postby vj » 25 Aug 2007, 15:04

Hello gennattasio :D !
I'm so glad we could help you get started again.
Most of the records we found are from ancestry.com.
It's a paid subscription site that I believe
you can 'preview' for free (without
seeing the actual records)
Your local library may have free access.
The Ellis Island site is free and definitely
worth going thru to find possible relatives
(may be visiting your family!)
The Castle Garden part
of the site that Bob, gave you has
ship manifest (transcripts only)
for NY arrivals before 1892.
Essgee can better answer how she found your
manifest - but I checked and it is on the [url=http://www.jewishgen.org/databases/EIDB/ellisgold.html]Ellis
Island site[/url].
Since your family appears to have been in NYC
you may want to check another free site:
Italian Genealogical Group.
Some of their links were down yesterday. If
you can locate probable records for your family,
they have links & forms for ordering them.
Hope this helps a bit!
Valarie

edit: added
Hey Essgee :D !

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Re: Advice for newbie please

Postby vj » 25 Aug 2007, 15:26

Condo

Several interesting records, are they the
same family?

edit: changed order of records

1920 census
Home in 1920:
241 Fifteenth St 7th & 8th Ave
Manhattan Assembly District 3, New York, New York
head Joseph Condo 22
wife Louise Condo 21
son Frank Condo 2 4/12
son Joseph Condo 3/12

1920 census
Frances Condo & children
Home in 1920:
183 Thompson Street
Manhattan Assembly District 2, New York, New York
Francisco Condo 49 (abt 1871) IT
[Francies Condo]
- widow
- immig 1901? Al
daughter Mary Condo 24 (abt 1896) IT
- immig 1901?
daughter Florence (Filomena?) Condo 17 (abt 1903) NY?
daughter Lauria Condo 16 (abt 1904) NY

1918 WWI Draft Registration Card
Joseph Paul Condo
161 West 15th Street, NY
born 2 Aug 1897 in Newark
father born in Naples
relative: Mrs Frances Condo
183 Thompson St, NY

Same family?
1910 census
Home in 1910:
178 Thompson Street, rents
Manhattan Ward 15, New York, New York
head Frances Conte 38 (abt 1872) IT
[Francesco Conto]
- widow
- 6 children born, 5 children living
- immig 1902
daughter Coretta Conte 19 (abt 1891) IT
- immig 1902
daughter Maria Annie Conte 15 (abt 1895) IT
- immig 1902
son Joseph Conte 14 (abt 1896) IT
daughter Mamie Conte 6 (abt 1904) NJ
daughter Kenna (Laura) Conte 5 (abt 1905) NJ

Does this manifest belong to this family?
1901 manifest
1901 manifest version from ancestry
28 Oct 1901 SS Nord America Palermo to NY
lines 13-16
Francesca Pissroli??? 31 (abt 1870)
- last residence Oppiolo??
- destination Newark NJ
- joining husband Francesco Candiolo???
Marianna Condo 7 (abt 1894)
Giuseppe Condo 5 (abt 1896)
Maria Condo 1 yr 5 mos (abt 1899)
(Name above the Condo family is coming from
Verbicaro, Cosenza, Calabria
Could the town be Oppido Mamertina,
Reggio Calabria, Calabria)


same manifest:
from ancestry.com
1901 detained page
Line 145 (written over 25)
Francesca Risidi & 3 chld
(to husb) Newark, NJ, ??
(to) husb. Francesco? Condo 343 Mullby (Mulberry?) St, Newark, NJ
discharged 10/28 3:45
4 dinners

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Re: Advice for newbie please

Postby vj » 25 Aug 2007, 22:28

Francesco Condo

1892 manifest
Francesco's 1st trip?
Arrival Date: 25 Jun 1892
Ship Name: Plata
Port of Departure: Naples, Italy
Port of Arrival: New York, New York
Microfilm Serial: M237 Microfilm Roll: M237_591
Line: 78
Name: Francesco Coudo
Estimated birth year: abt 1860 Age: 32
- tailor
Place of Origin: Oppido
Last Residence: Messina
Destination: New York

1901 manifest
Francesco & daughter Concetta's manifest?
7 May 1901 SS Trave Bremen to NY
Lines 6&7
Francesco Cando 41 (abt 1860)
- tailor
- last residence Messina???
- Newark written in?
- in US before, 8 years?
- joining sister Maria, Mulberry St?
Concetta Cando 11 (abt 1890)

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vj
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Re: Advice for newbie please

Postby vj » 25 Aug 2007, 23:16

Condo

If your Condo family is from Oppido,
the Family History Library should have
your family's original records microfilm.
If you haven't been to your local
Family History Center before,
here's a link to the home page on
their website.
You would have to visit them to
order, then view your films.
(the folks at your center will help!)

Note: If you haven't seen this from the Family
History Center, Italy Research Outline, it's
a great help :wink: . You'll also find descriptions of
the microfilms and what's on them.

Title
Registri dello stato civile, 1809-1910
Authors
Oppido Mamertina (Reggio di Calabria).
Ufficio dello stato civile (Main Author)
Notes
Births, deaths, marriages, miscellaneous documents,
marriage documents.
Subjects
Italy, Reggio di Calabria, Oppido Mamertina
- Civil registration

Format
Manuscript (On Film)
Language
Italian
Publication
Salt Lake City, Utah :
Filmati dalla Genealogical Society of Utah, 1987-1995
Physical
in 19 bobine di microfilm ; 16 mm.

Film Notes
Note - Location [Film]
Nati 1809-1828 - FHL INTL Film [ 1518324 Items 6-7 ]
Nati 1828-1865 - FHL INTL Film [ 1518325 ]
Nati 1866-1871 - VAULT INTL Film [ 1916490 Item 2 ]
Nati 1871-1883; Cittadinanza 1879 - FHL INTL Film [ 1916492 ]
Nati 1883-1898 - FHL INTL Film [ 1916493 ]
Nati 1898-1910; Matrimoni 1880-1888 - VAULT INTL Film [ 1916494 ]
Matrimoni 1889-1910; Morti 1880-1892 - VAULT INTL Film [ 1916495 ]
Morti 1892-1910 - VAULT INTL Film [ 1916615 Item 1 ]
Matrimoni 1809-1830 - FHL INTL Film [ 1604210 Items 6-7 ]
Matrimoni 1830-1865 - FHL INTL Film [ 1604276 Items 1-2 ]
Morti 1809-1854 - VAULT INTL Film [ 1340046 Items 2-4 ]
Morti 1855-1865 - FHL INTL Film [ 1546969 Item 1 ]
Atti diversi 1825-1857 - FHL INTL Film [ 1607612 Item 5 ]
Atti diversi 1848 - FHL INTL Film [ 1797830 Item 3 ]
Atti diversi 1858-1865 - FHL INTL Film [ 1607692 Item 1 ]
Processetti 1809-1841 - VAULT INTL Film [ 1692817 ]
Processetti 1842-1850 - VAULT INTL Film [ 1692896 ]
Processetti 1851-1860 - VAULT INTL Film [ 1692927 ]
Processetti 1860-1865 - VAULT INTL Film [ 1692928 Items 1-2 ]

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gennattasio
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Re: Advice for newbie please

Postby gennattasio » 26 Aug 2007, 04:16

Ciao amici,
Sono contentissima, siete fantastici!!! I am having problems with my internet so now I am at a friend's house printing all of the amazing information you have given me. My head is exploding with happiness and excitement. Yes VJ, the 1920 census is my grandparents.
My dearest friend is looking for her great grandmother's brothers who went to Argentina for work. Her family was extremely upset by their disappearance and talks about it all the time to this day.
Grazie amici, siete meravigliosi, è un miracolo che li ho trovati. Grazi mille.

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Re: Advice for newbie please

Postby Cathynap » 26 Aug 2007, 04:27

There are 2 sites that I go to regularly to find South American connections. The first is a crude incomplete collection of ship records. It is the not as complete as the Ellis Island databases but it is a start.
http://213.212.128.168/radici/ie/defaultie_e.htm
The second site is in Spanish. It is an outstanding site designed to help South Americans of Italian ancestry to find their Italian roots. On this site they have a huge database (base de datos) of South Americans looking for information on their Italian ancestors. You can search by surname and will be taken to a list that will tell you the comune name their ancestor came from and provide an email address of a person to contact. Again - it is a spanish speaking site. Click on Listado de Apellidos then base de datos when you get there. They also have a forum, if you can speak spanish.
http://www.apellidositalianos.com.ar/

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Re: Advice for newbie please

Postby NOLA » 26 Aug 2007, 13:06

On the Ellis Island registry, there was only one Gennattasio, one Pasquale, a shoemaker whose last residence in Europe was Avignon, France, but was listed as Italian. He came to the US in 1900, and was planning to join relatives in Pennsylvania.

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Re: Frank Condo

Postby NOLA » 26 Aug 2007, 13:15

There seems to be many Francesco Condos on the Ellis Island Registry. Petrizzi in Calabria is the place from which most of them came. There is also a Felice. Perhaps, this person could also be the one since many immigrants tried to change their Italian names and Felice would be Felix in english.


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