Discorde in the Family

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Discorde in the Family

Postby lbernard3 » 06 Jul 2011, 01:23

The below quote was written at the bottom of my g-grandparents Pubblicazione di Matrimonio.

"e dichiarato che per essere in ciò discorde la moglie fua Rosaria Robilotta non e qui comparsa"

Rosaria was his mother. I am wondering what "discorde" meant on a 1901 wedding announcement? Early in the record is states that only the father was present. I believe I read one could not get a divorce. Any information would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks for any help.

Lou
Researching family surnames are Bernardo/Robilotta from Gallicchio, Basilicata.
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Re: Discorde in the Family

Postby johnnyonthespot » 06 Jul 2011, 01:58

Maybe she did not agree with the marriage and refused to appear?
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Re: Discorde in the Family

Postby PippoM » 06 Jul 2011, 12:42

Well, if you just want to know what it means in Italian...yes, that's it. It means that she did not agree (probably, about the marriage)
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Re: Discorde in the Family

Postby lbernard3 » 06 Jul 2011, 13:08

PippoM wrote:Well, if you just want to know what it means in Italian...yes, that's it. It means that she did not agree (probably, about the marriage)



@Pippo-Could you please explain your answer better?
I know that sometimes, in today's world, we say things in a certain way to cover up the real meaning of what we are saying. The context in which we say things matters, too. Was the discord about the wedding or between parents? Is there any way to tell? (I think she may have immigrated to the USA 2 years before this wedding-without the family!-could this be the "discorde"?)


Thanks again for any help
Lou

Here are the last paragraphs on the Pubblicazione (I think I have them transcribed correctly):

I documenti sono: le copie degli atti di nascita de gli sposi, rilasciate de questo ufficio della stata civile in data odierna - E` altresi comparso Luigi Bernardo padre della sposa il quala di li consenso per contrarre il richiesto matrimonio, e dichiarato che per essere in ciò discorde la moglie fu Rosaria Robilotta non e qui comparsa

Letto il presente atto a tutti gli intervenuti si sano meco sottoscritto il padre dello sposo ed i testimoni soltanto, per essere gli spesi analfabeti



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Re: Discorde in the Family

Postby PippoM » 07 Jul 2011, 07:52

What I meant is that, when I replied, I was wondering if you had some problem with the comprehension of Italian language, or you wanted to know what was beyond the disagreement. As I had not read the document, I could not give an answer...I could only say what the meaning in Italian was. By reading the document, it seems clear that the mother did not agree "about the marriage": "per essere IN CIO' discorde". At that time, parents had to give their consent. If I'm not wrong, mother's consent had to be expressed, even if it was not vinculating.
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Re: Discorde in the Family

Postby lbernard3 » 07 Jul 2011, 14:30

Thank you for your response. I am sorry to say that I have no comprehension of the Italian language. Any translating I am doing is through this forum or through Google translate. I read in an Italian genealogy book that the use of "fua" before the parent's name meant that they were deceased.

I was wondering about specifically about the part where it stated "per essere in cio discorde fua Rosaria Robilotta"

Lou B.
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Re: Discorde in the Family

Postby PippoM » 07 Jul 2011, 14:42

You wrote:
"e dichiarato che per essere in ciò discorde la moglie fua Rosaria Robilotta non e qui comparsa"
For deceased people you would generally find the word "fu", not "fua", that does not exist. In this context, it would be good to read from the original document.
In fact, in the writing of XIX century, it is easy to confund "f" with "s", and in
this case, the sentence would be "la moglie sua" (his wife).
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Re: Discorde in the Family

Postby lbernard3 » 07 Jul 2011, 15:55

Here is the orig. document. I think you are right-that it is a "s" instead of a "f". Take a look and see what you think. Thanks.


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Re: Discorde in the Family

Postby PippoM » 07 Jul 2011, 23:36

I confirm my opinion: the mother did not agree about the marriage, so she wasn't at the office to give her consent.
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Re: Discorde in the Family

Postby jennabet » 08 Jul 2011, 07:28

It means, "Parenti sono Serpenti" or "Relatives are Snakes", as they say in Italy. LOL.
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Re: Discorde in the Family

Postby msoetinger » 14 Jul 2011, 22:47

This is a translation of what you noted above- somethings don't translate well from language to language.hope it helps some.
documents include: copies of birth certificates of the spouses, was released from this office of civil Today - It is ALSO Louis Bernard appeared on the bride's father which of them the required permission to contract marriage, and declared that to be this discord was the wife Rosaria Robilotta not appear here

Read this document to all participants signed me healthy is the father of the groom and the witnesses only, to be spent on the illiterate
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Re: Discorde in the Family

Postby lbernard3 » 19 Jul 2011, 13:25

Thank you all for responding. But I still must be not asking the right question.

I believe Rosaria, the mother of the groom, may have left the family in Italy and moved to the USA a few years before the marriage. So she wasn't there for the wedding/signing of the papers.

But what I can't get answered is this:

Does the document actually state that she had the problem with the marriage and wasn't there, or is everyone who is helping me with this assume that this is what the document means? Could it mean that there was "discorde" in the family because she left and wasn't even around?

Is there any way to tell? Or am I just looking for something that cannot be answered with this document?

Thank you all again for your time.
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