Bride's parents not named and surname question

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Bride's parents not named and surname question

Postby CowryShells » 10 Jul 2010, 19:46

Hello!

I wonder why the bride's parents are not named in these marriage banns. Isn't the bride herself standing in front of the registrar? Why wouldn't she be able to give her parents' names?


My second challenge is the bride's surname and the words following it. Here's what I have for the last two handwritten lines:
(figlio) di Pasquale defunto e di Arcangela Cursio defunta e
Maria Rosa _?_ __?__ __?__ figlia di


I'd appreciate any help deciphering this. Thank you!
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Re: Bride's parents not named and surname question

Postby dragoni » 10 Jul 2010, 20:35

the word after maria rosa is her surname, but i cannot decipher it. the other words, variations of parenti ignoti - parents unknown.

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Re: Bride's parents not named and surname question

Postby CowryShells » 10 Jul 2010, 21:02

Thank you, Tommaso!

Does this mean the bride was an orphan or an abandoned child?
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Re: Bride's parents not named and surname question

Postby CowryShells » 11 Jul 2010, 11:54

Here's another look at the bride's surname. It's on the extreme left, the lowest name underlined in white. It looks like Cujus, does that make sense? If she was abandoned as an infant she would have a surname created by the mayor, is that correct?


Also, the words immediately following look like the Latin version of what you wrote, Tommaso: parentes incompertus
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Re: Bride's parents not named and surname question

Postby dragoni » 11 Jul 2010, 18:50

cuius essentially means citizen, in this case just identifying citizen with parents unknown. the letter is definitely i not j, i have seen the older style writing like that in a variety of italian documents.

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Re: Bride's parents not named and surname question

Postby Italysearcher » 11 Jul 2010, 19:14

If you are sure that Maria Rosa is her name then she may not have been given a surname, or Rosa was her surname.
In some towns (although it was before 1800) I have seen that abandoned girls were not given a surname since any children they might have would bear the father's surname.
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Re: Bride's parents not named and surname question

Postby CowryShells » 11 Jul 2010, 19:17

Thanks, Tommaso!

My Latin dictionary says cuius means "to whom belonging?" or "whose?" (interrogative pronoun)

Second meaning: (relative pronoun) whose
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Re: Bride's parents not named and surname question

Postby CowryShells » 11 Jul 2010, 19:25

<<If you are sure that Maria Rosa is her name then she may not have been given a surname, or Rosa was her surname.
In some towns (although it was before 1800) I have seen that abandoned girls were not given a surname since any children they might have would bear the father's surname.>>

Thank you, Ann! That is interesting.

I am trying to make sense of this surname. When Maria Rosa delivers her first son, 19 years later, her name is written as Maria Rosa Paciulli.
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Re: Bride's parents not named and surname question

Postby Italysearcher » 11 Jul 2010, 20:56

It is important to notice whether she is the only Paciulli in town. Abandoned babies were almost always given surnames that did not exist in the town. Since she survived childhood she may have been given that surname later.
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Re: Bride's parents not named and surname question

Postby CowryShells » 11 Jul 2010, 21:10

Good information, thank you!

That would be in 1848. I don't know how I would find out if she was the only one with that surname at that time. She may have been given the surname earlier, but that is the next document I have for her, her son's birth record.

I will certainly keep an eye out for the surname as I go through the town's microfilm.
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