Help with translation

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Help with translation

Postby DAT1957 » 27 Oct 2010, 23:40

I have been looking for my grandfather's roots with little success. His name here in the U.S. was Giacomo Perocelli. He was born in Nibbia, Italy. I have not been able to find him on passenger lists on Ancestry.com or Ellis Island. He claimed to have been in the San Francisco earthquake in 1906, but census records I have been able to find show his arrival year as 1909 or 1908, so I'm not sure when he arrived. His name on those records was listed as Jim Pedroncelli, G. Petrelli, James Petrocelli.

I do have a 1965 document from Comune di San Pietro Mosezzo regarding his birth history that my grandmother requested for naturalization purposes. (However, I'm not able to find those records either.) Parts of it are difficult to read so I don't think it will scan to upload. Following is an excerpt in Italian (which I don't speak/read):

"Sul certificato che Vi sara trasmesso con ogni sollecitudine, non appena sara legalizzato, troverete che sui Registri di nascita dell'anno 1882 il Vs/ cognome non e statto iscritto come Perocelli ma PERUCELLI Giacomo, di Giovanni e della Antonia GUATTEO, nato a Nibbia il 20 gennaio 1882.

Dai documenti d'archivio risulta che Vs/ padre e nato pure a Nibbia il 17.12.1854 da Pietro Peruselli del fu Giovanni (di professione falegname, professione esercitata anche da Vs/ padre allorquando ha denunciato la Vs/ nascita) e da Beatrice De Angelis.

Gli atti di Stato Civile erano allora redatti dai Parroci e non dagli Uffici Comunali. In quei registri di nascita Vs/ padre doveva essere iscritto come Giovanni PERUCELLI mentre invece risulta in PIETRO GIOVANNI PERUSELLI e probabilmente veniva chiamato col secondo nome essendo il primo identico a quello di suo padre."

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!
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Re: Help with translation

Postby Tessa78 » 28 Oct 2010, 00:03

Hi :-)

It states that on the birth registers for the year 1882, his last name is not written as Perocelli but PERUCELLI Giacomo, son of Giovanni and Antonia Guatteo, born in Nibbia, January 20, 1882.

From archival documents it shows that his father was born also in Nibbia December 17, 1854 by Pietro Peruselli, son of the late Giovanni (carpenter by profession, occupation practiced also by his father when he denounced the his birth)??? and Beatrice De Angelis .

The acts were then prepared by the Civil Parish and Municipal Offices. In those records of birth his father was written as PERUCELLI Giovanni instead of Pietro Giovanni PERUSELLI and probably was called by the middle name since the first is identical to that of his father.


It would help us to help you if we could see the document.
We have some very talented volunteers who can read handwriting you didn't think was possible...
Try uploading a scanned image to www.imageshack.com

T.
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Re: Help with translation

Postby DAT1957 » 28 Oct 2010, 16:24

I hope I did it correctly. Its actually a typewritten letter that has aged over the years. Here's the link:

http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/9092/letter.pdf

Thanks so much!
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Re: Help with translation

Postby liviomoreno » 28 Oct 2010, 17:06

T., I have made some correction to your translation...

The certificate that we will promptly send to you,as soon it is legalized, will show you that on the birth registers for the year 1882, your last name is not written as Perocelli but PERUCELLI Giacomo, son of Giovanni and Antonia Guatteo, born in Nibbia, January 20, 1882.

From archival documents it shows that your father was born also in Nibbia December 17, 1854 to Pietro Peruselli, son of the late Giovanni (carpenter by profession, occupation practiced also by your father when he denounced your birth) and to Beatrice De Angelis .

At that time vital records were prepared by the Parishes and not by Municipal Offices. In those records the birth of your father should have been written as PERUCELLI Giovanni instead of Pietro Giovanni PERUSELLI and probably he was called by the middle name since the first is identical to that of his father.


In the first paragraph they say that they received the request including a Postal Money Order of 1$.
The second paragraph is to ask for another dollar, because one is not sufficient to cover the expenses (1200 Lit, and 1$=620 Lit)...
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Re: Help with translation

Postby DAT1957 » 28 Oct 2010, 17:32

Thank you so very much, Livio! My mother, aunt and uncle will be so happy to finally have this information. While they spoke the Ticinese dialect of Italian (my grandmother was born in Intragna, Switzerland), it has been many years since my grandparents died (1969 & 1970) and they have forgotten some of the language.

I'm very intrigued regarding the reference to being denounced by his father... To the best of my knowledge, they do not have a copy of the certificate.

Again, thank you so very, very much!

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Re: Help with translation

Postby Tessa78 » 28 Oct 2010, 19:47

Thanks, Livio, for the additions/corrections :-)

I was also intrigued by the "denounced" reference..

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Re: Help with translation

Postby liviomoreno » 29 Oct 2010, 05:37

Maybe the word "denounce" is not correct!
"allorquando ha denunciato la Vs/ nascita" = "when he reported your birth"
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Re: Help with translation

Postby DAT1957 » 30 Oct 2010, 18:21

I hope that is the correct interpretation. Otherwise, we will always wonder why he was "denounced".

Thank you, Livio!
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