Help with this record, Please

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Help with this record, Please

Postby bottino » 19 Jan 2012, 17:08

I an reposting this record, in a little larger format. It is different from the usual birth records that I have been reading. Can someone tell me something about this record, and why it is different.
Thanks
Paul
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Re: Help with this record, Please

Postby liviomoreno » 19 Jan 2012, 20:04

The image is very small. I suggest that you use a hosting system to upload a large image...
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Re: Help with this record, Please

Postby bottino » 19 Jan 2012, 20:31

Livo
I am using Image Shack. In my first posting, the image was too big, and did not fit here on the forum. So I made it smaller so you can see the entire record. Can you recommend something else.
Thanks
Paul
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Re: Help with this record, Please

Postby liviomoreno » 19 Jan 2012, 20:39

Paul, you must provide the link (URL) to the picture in ImageShack
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Re: Help with this record, Please

Postby bottino » 19 Jan 2012, 20:47

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Re: Help with this record, Please

Postby PippoM » 20 Jan 2012, 09:14

Francesca Maria xxxxx (I can't understand it) was born on November 13th, 1810, as a natural daughter (child of an unmarried couple) of Giovannina Bersano (?), widow of the late Cesare Data (?).
Godparents were Domenico Bertot and Maria, wife of Battista Bertot.

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Giuseppe "Pippo" Moccaldi

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Re: Help with this record, Please

Postby liviomoreno » 20 Jan 2012, 09:26

bottino wrote:I an reposting this record, in a little larger format. It is different from the usual birth records that I have been reading. Can someone tell me something about this record, and why it is different.
Thanks
Paul


This looks like a church record, not a civil record, namely it is a baptism record.
What I do not understand is the word on the left of the record, usually there should be the surname and name...
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Re: Help with this record, Please

Postby liviomoreno » 20 Jan 2012, 09:33

PippoM wrote:Francesca Maria xxxxx (I can't understand it) was born on November 13th, 1810, as a natural daughter (child of an unmarried couple) of Giovannina Bersano (?), widow of the late Cesare Data (?).
Godparents were Domenico Bertot and Maria, wife of Battista Bertot.

Better someone helps this transcription!

A more literal translation is:

The year 1810 Francesca Maria xxxxx natural female child of Giovannina Bersano (?), widow of the late Cesare Data (?) was born on November 13th, the same day xxxxx she was baptized by me being Godparents Domenico Bertot and Maria, wife of Battista Bertot xxxxxxx.
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Re: Help with this record, Please

Postby Lucap » 20 Jan 2012, 10:48

Il fatto che non ci sia il cognome ma l'abbreviazione "Nat" (naturalis) ci dice che Giovannina Berzano (probabilmente) ha avuto quella figlia ben oltre i nove mesi successivi alla morte del marito ed è per questo che (secondo il prete) la figlia è naturale e non legittima. Sarebbe da trovare la data di morte di Cesare Data e verificare se l'ipotesi è giusta o no.
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Re: Help with this record, Please

Postby bottino » 20 Jan 2012, 16:54

Thank you all very much. Now this all makes good sense. This is the first time I have encountered a record in this format. Can I conclude then, that since Giovanna was married the actual surname of the child Francisca would be Data?
Again thank you very much.
Paul
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Re: Help with this record, Please

Postby liviomoreno » 20 Jan 2012, 17:01

bottino wrote:Thank you all very much. Now this all makes good sense. This is the first time I have encountered a record in this format. Can I conclude then, that since Giovanna was married the actual surname of the child Francisca would be Data?
Again thank you very much.
Paul


In my opinion NO. Apparently Giovanna was not the daughter of Cesare. I would go for Bersano as her surname. I might be wrong.
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Re: Help with this record, Please

Postby bottino » 21 Jan 2012, 05:36

Livio, but aren't we saying that Giovanna is the widow of Cesare Data. That's why I am suggesting that the correct surname is Data.
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Re: Help with this record, Please

Postby liviomoreno » 21 Jan 2012, 08:29

bottino wrote:Livio, but aren't we saying that Giovanna is the widow of Cesare Data. That's why I am suggesting that the correct surname is Data.
Paul

As Lucap suggested in his post you should figure out when Cesare died.

Here is a translation of Lucap's post:

"The fact that instead of the surname there is the abbreviation "Nat" (naturalis) tells that Giovannina Bersano (probably) had that child more than nine months after her husband's death and this is why (according the priest) the daughter is identified as natural rather than legitimate. It would be a good idea to find Cesare Data's death date and verify. "
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