Never saw a document like this

Having problems with the Italian language? Do you need help to translate or understand an old family document? There is always someone who can help you!
oemorg
Rookie
Rookie
Posts: 84
Joined: 26 Jun 2013, 22:03

Never saw a document like this

Postby oemorg » 11 Jan 2014, 17:41

This document was found in the processetti of Antonio Raimondi. He was born in Rotunda and got married in Spezzano Albanese. Does it just say that he does not reside in Rotunda and now is living in Spezzano Albanese? Does this document have an official name?

Thanks for your help,
Greg
Attachments
7168antonioraimondi&mariateresacairoproc1825pg02a.jpg

erudita74
Master
Master
Posts: 4843
Joined: 27 Aug 2012, 20:26

Re: Never saw a document like this

Postby erudita74 » 11 Jan 2014, 20:59

oemorg wrote:This document was found in the processetti of Antonio Raimondi. He was born in Rotunda and got married in Spezzano Albanese. Does it just say that he does not reside in Rotunda and now is living in Spezzano Albanese? Does this document have an official name?

Thanks for your help,
Greg



Greg
I also have never seen a document like this one with the processetti. I can read the beg part where it says that the town official of Rotunda certifies that for many years Antonio has lived in Spezzano. What I can't decipher are two words in the next section, so I really can't say for sure what it is saying. This is what I am deciphering:

Si certifica inoltre che lo stesso viene riputato ? di sua famiglia e per conseguenza non ha fatto parte della ? di questo comune.

One furthermore certifies that the same individual(referring to Antonio) comes judged ? of his family and, as a result, has not made part of the ? of this town.

It sounds to me that, due to the reputation of his family in the town of Rotunda, one of the requirements for the marriage was waived by the town of Rotunda, even though Antonio had been living in Spezzano for many years.

Erudita

User avatar
suanj
V.I.P.
V.I.P.
Posts: 12490
Joined: 20 Feb 2003, 00:00
Location: Molise region, Italy
Contact:

Re: Never saw a document like this

Postby suanj » 11 Jan 2014, 21:06

It is a certificate "di stato libero" (marital status) abt Antonio RAIMONDO; the Mayor certified that Antonio was single, so he can marry in Spezzano..
suanj
Visit my website:
ITALIAN ORIGIN SEARCH

erudita74
Master
Master
Posts: 4843
Joined: 27 Aug 2012, 20:26

Re: Never saw a document like this

Postby erudita74 » 11 Jan 2014, 21:19

suanj wrote:It is a certificate "di stato libero" (marital status) abt Antonio RAIMONDO; the Mayor certified that Antonio was single, so he can marry in Spezzano..
suanj



suanj
I have seen those types of documents many times and this one reads nothing like those. Can you decipher the two words I couldn't read, please?
Erudita

User avatar
suanj
V.I.P.
V.I.P.
Posts: 12490
Joined: 20 Feb 2003, 00:00
Location: Molise region, Italy
Contact:

Re: Never saw a document like this

Postby suanj » 11 Jan 2014, 22:10

E' certificato vero da me sottoscritto Sindaco del Comune di Rotonda in Basilicata, Distretto di Lagonegro, qualmente il nomato Antonio Raimondo figlio del fu Giuseppe e Maria di Sanzo (?), già domiciliato nel Comune di Spezzano, in Calabria Citeriore, da molti anni. Si certifica inoltre che lo stesso viene riputato ... di sua famiglia, e per conseguenza non ha fatto parte della Leva di questo Comune. Quindi per la visita se ne è formato il presente, sottoscritto da me, e dal mio Cancelliere da servire per uso di matrimonio, e munito del Comunal suggello.
Rotonda 20 Dicembre 1848
Il Sindaco del Comune
Giuseppe Forte
Il Cancelliere Comunale
....

In the old past time a man- for to marry -needed this certificate in which the Mayor testified that the man had no family (in the sense that he was unmarried) in the birth commune and that made the military service..
The Mayor certifies that Antonio Raimondo no was married in Rotonda and no result to be in the list of men born in Rotonda and enrolled in the Army for national service ...

I saw many times a similar document; it is wrote in old italian language, and it is no a filled form, so every Mayor wrote it... according to his own culture....
I am sure that is a old certificate " di stato libero e servizio di leva assolto"
suanj
Visit my website:
ITALIAN ORIGIN SEARCH

erudita74
Master
Master
Posts: 4843
Joined: 27 Aug 2012, 20:26

Re: Never saw a document like this

Postby erudita74 » 11 Jan 2014, 22:20

suanj wrote:E' certificato vero da me sottoscritto Sindaco del Comune di Rotonda in Basilicata, Distretto di Lagonegro, qualmente il nomato Antonio Raimondo figlio del fu Giuseppe e Maria di Sanzo (?), già domiciliato nel Comune di Spezzano, in Calabria Citeriore, da molti anni. Si certifica inoltre che lo stesso viene riputato ... di sua famiglia, e per conseguenza non ha fatto parte della Leva di questo Comune. Quindi per la visita se ne è formato il presente, sottoscritto da me, e dal mio Cancelliere da servire per uso di matrimonio, e munito del Comunal suggello.
Rotonda 20 Dicembre 1848
Il Sindaco del Comune
Giuseppe Forte
Il Cancelliere Comunale
....

In the old past time a man- for to marry -needed this certificate in which the Mayor testified that the man had no family (in the sense that he was unmarried) in the birth commune and that made the military service..
The Mayor certifies that Antonio Raimondo no was married in Rotonda and no result to be in the list of men born in Rotonda and enrolled in the Army for national service ...

I saw many times a similar document; it is wrote in old italian language, and it is no a filled form, so every Mayor wrote it... according to his own culture....
I am sure that is a old certificate " di stato libero e servizio di leva assolto"
suanj


suanj,
I know from my many years of research that, in earlier times, a man needed such a certificate as proof that he was not already married, did not have military obligations, and even that he was not a member of the clergy or any religious order. I have seen many handwritten ones that have varied in wording, but I just couldn't decipher the two words in the second part of the document and never would have guessed that this was such a certificate. Many that I have seen have not been titled as such certificates either, yet I could clearly tell from reading them that they were certificates of the man's free state. It just bothers me that I can't decipher those two words in this document.
Thanks for your comments.
Erudita

User avatar
suanj
V.I.P.
V.I.P.
Posts: 12490
Joined: 20 Feb 2003, 00:00
Location: Molise region, Italy
Contact:

Re: Never saw a document like this

Postby suanj » 11 Jan 2014, 22:27

Yes is no titled, but as I said every Mayor wrote it as better as best he could...
I found a very similar document also in the Processetto Matrimoniale of GGGF of my husband...
suanj
Visit my website:
ITALIAN ORIGIN SEARCH

oemorg
Rookie
Rookie
Posts: 84
Joined: 26 Jun 2013, 22:03

Re: Never saw a document like this

Postby oemorg » 12 Jan 2014, 13:47

Erudita & Suanj,

Thanks very much for taking the time to help me with this document. I now have to go back and give a closer look at all the processettis I have to see if there are any similar documents in them that I thought were something else. Even if they are handwritten I should be able to figure out if it is a di stato libero by comparing them to your translations. I am sure my 3rd great grand uncle, Antonio, is happy because I now know that his marriage was legitimate.

Thanks again,
Greg

erudita74
Master
Master
Posts: 4843
Joined: 27 Aug 2012, 20:26

Re: Never saw a document like this

Postby erudita74 » 12 Jan 2014, 15:02

oemorg wrote:Erudita & Suanj,

Thanks very much for taking the time to help me with this document. I now have to go back and give a closer look at all the processettis I have to see if there are any similar documents in them that I thought were something else. Even if they are handwritten I should be able to figure out if it is a di stato libero by comparing them to your translations. I am sure my 3rd great grand uncle, Antonio, is happy because I now know that his marriage was legitimate.

Thanks again,
Greg



Hi Greg
I'm thankful to suanj for figuring out what kind of document this was. If I had been able to decipher the word leva, as she did, then I probably would have known. I have seen this type of document with processetti from various towns, but the wording has always been very different and easy for me, at least, to determine just what kind of document it was. Just glad suanj came to the rescue. Thank you again, suanj.
Erudita


Return to “Italian language, handwriting , script & translations”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google Adsense [Bot] and 4 guests