Second marriage?

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Donnars11
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Second marriage?

Postby Donnars11 » 15 Oct 2014, 03:24

Hi, can anyone read item 2 and 3 below (Image 8 and 10) for any mention of Giuseppe's first wife's death. I included the birth record to prove that this Giuseppe is the same Giuseppe in both cases. I've looked through each death record from the date of the first marriage (7/31/1865) until the date of the second marriage. I can not find a death record for Maria Concetta Fanelli. Any ideas? Thoughts? Thanks, Donna

Image #382 Birth record from Matrimoni Processetti of Giuseppe Mignogne/Maria Concetta Fanelli.
http://www.antenati.san.beniculturali.i ... ewsIndex=0

Image #8 Record #6 Marriage record Giuseppe Mignogne/Raffaela Sassani
http://www.antenati.san.beniculturali.i ... 3.jpg.html


Image #10 record #6 Matrimoni Pubblicazione Giuseppe Mignogna/Raffaela Sassani
http://www.antenati.san.beniculturali.i ... 4.jpg.html

erudita74
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Re: Second marriage?

Postby erudita74 » 15 Oct 2014, 05:24

In the two bottom records, he is referred to as "celibe" which means "never before married male." He is not referred to as "vedovo" which would be "widower." In the bottom record, he presented an extracted copy of his birth act, as did the bride, and the dates of their births are given. The date given for his birth matches that on his birth record. There is no mention of a death act of a first wife being presented as a supporting document for this marriage. These records do not give any indication that he had a previous wife.

Erudita

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liviomoreno
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Re: Second marriage?

Postby liviomoreno » 15 Oct 2014, 08:20

Giuseppe Mignogna married first Raffaela Sassani in 1849 and Concetta Fanelli in 1865, so you should search for a death record for Raffaela, not for Concetta.

AngelaGrace56
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Re: Second marriage?

Postby AngelaGrace56 » 15 Oct 2014, 09:27

Livio, I am reading that Giuseppe Mignogna and Raffaela Sassani were married 1869? I looked at this briefly earlier just before Erudita posted and I was looking at the second page of the Marriage Banns and I think it was saying (my broken Italian here) that they both declared that neither had been married before? I may have this bit wrong?

Angela

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liviomoreno
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Re: Second marriage?

Postby liviomoreno » 15 Oct 2014, 09:38

I'm sorry. I don't know how I could read 1849...
Image

AngelaGrace56
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Re: Second marriage?

Postby AngelaGrace56 » 15 Oct 2014, 10:06

:lol:

It happens.

Angela :)

erudita74
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Re: Second marriage?

Postby erudita74 » 15 Oct 2014, 13:06

Not only do both marriage documents read 1869, but Angela is correct, as on the 2nd page of the marriage pub, it states "hanno dichiarato...che oggi non hanno mai contratto precedente matrimonio." So they both stated that they had never before contracted marriage. Also his age of 32, and having been born in 1836, is more consistent with an 1869 marriage than with an 1849 marriage.
Erudita

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Donnars11
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Re: Second marriage?

Postby Donnars11 » 15 Oct 2014, 15:20

Thank you all for your responses. Yes this "second Marriage" is in 1869. I've included in this post the actual marriage record for the "first marriage" in 1865. Notice that Giuseppe's mother is written as Marianna however in the Prossesseti it shows as Mariangela. Perhaps this is the problem but the date of birth is correct. Maybe you can make more sense of this seeing the entire picture. I must be missing something. Thx. Donna

Marriage record #44 image 52.
http://www.antenati.san.beniculturali.i ... ewsIndex=0

erudita74
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Re: Second marriage?

Postby erudita74 » 15 Oct 2014, 15:43

Donna
I don't believe this marriage actually took place. The solemn promise is just that-a promise to marry in the Church, according to the requirements set forth by the Sacred Council of Trent. The solemn promise was done in the presence of town officials and and in the presence of parents and witnesses. If you notice the right column, there is no information filled in by the parish priest. So to me this means that this marriage never took place for a reason not specified in the record. I think the information in Giuseppe's other marriage documents confirms this. I believe that his 1869 marriage was his first marriage.
Erudita

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Donnars11
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Re: Second marriage?

Postby Donnars11 » 15 Oct 2014, 15:55

Interesting. I wonder how many other marriages I recorded that didn't take place. This couple had no children so that helps support your theory. I suppose I should go back and check out all the childless marriages and see if those couples really ever did get married. Thank you so much for that information. Donna

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Re: Second marriage?

Postby erudita74 » 15 Oct 2014, 20:48

You're welcome, Donna. Just looking at some of the marriage records which preceded and followed the 1865 one you posted, you will see that none of the others had the right columns blank like yours. So I doubt you will find in your possession too many others that are like Giuseppe's 1865 record.

Erudita


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