Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

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zitiello
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Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

Postby zitiello » 15 Oct 2007, 04:56

Hello,

I'm hoping someone can help guide me about two Italian areas. I have the passenger records from Ellis Island for both of my grandparents who came from Italy.

The record for my grandmother (Antoneta Carabba) says her residence was in S. Paolo Cle., Italy. I noticed there are several San Paolo's listed on the Italian World Club's website so I don't know which area I should be looking at.

My grandfather's (Gabriele Zitiello) passenger record states that his residence was S. Marco, Caserta.

If anyone can help clarify which regions/areas these two towns are, I would be very appreciative!

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Re: Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

Postby pink67 » 15 Oct 2007, 06:32

Hi Zitiello,

I think your grandmother Antoneta Carabba came from San Paolo di Civitate (Foggia Province - Region Puglia) .....

http://www.comune.sanpaolodicivitate.fg.it/

Your grandfather Zitiello Gabriele probably was coming from San Marco Evangelista in the Caserta Province - Region Campania

http://www.comuni-italiani.it/061/104/

Ciao!
Laura :)

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Re: Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

Postby zitiello » 15 Oct 2007, 06:40

Thank you! :P

Can you explain the difference between San Marco and San Marco Evangelista? Are they different places or one in the same? I see both listed under the Campania/Conserta area.

Is there a San Paolo related to the Bari area? My sister remembers something about Bari being related to the family some how.

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Re: Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

Postby pink67 » 15 Oct 2007, 06:53

Ciao!

This is the site where I found San Marco in Caserta Province:

http://www.italyworldclub.com/campania/caserta/

It's the only town with that name.... Perhaps you're thinking in San Marco as a disctrict of another bigger town?

Bari is in the same region of Foggia.... but at the moment I don't know if there is a Section San Paolo in Bari's area....
I'll search better.....

http://www.italyworldclub.com/puglia/

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Re: Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

Postby zitiello » 15 Oct 2007, 14:18

I'm sure you are correct. I just came across the mention of the other names on the italyworldclub.com site. One is under a town and one is under a village in relation to the San Marco in Caserta.

I also noticed San Paolo being listed as a town and a village in the Puglia area.

I was just trying to understand the regions a bit more and how to know if it is the town or the village that I need to look at more closely.

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Re: Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

Postby BillieDeKid » 15 Oct 2007, 15:06

Hi Zitiello,

The first link will give you a map with each region color coded

http://www.italiantourism.com/regions.html

The second link allows you to select any region and then it will list each province within the region and then selecting a province will give you a list of every town in that province. If you then select a town you get all their information including links to city maps etc.

http://en.comuni-italiani.it/

I hope this is helpful for you. It's been a great help to me.

Elizabeth

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Re: Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

Postby pink67 » 15 Oct 2007, 15:09

Ciao Zitiello! :D

before I searched I looked the arrival manifests, so I saw that Antoneta Carabba was travelling with her mother Trentalancia Assunta and they declared to coming from San Paolo Civitale, I also saw that the surname Carabba (really not very common in Italy!) is mostly present in the region Abruzzo (near Puglia):
Digit Carabba in "Cognome"...
http://gens.labo.net/it/cognomi/genera.html

I thinked that the town was probably mispelled because Civitale (without San Paolo) is a town in the north of Italy.... The nearby possibility for me is San Paolo di Civitate...Bari is the capital city of the Apulia (Puglia) region... so it's normal that your relatives talked about it... Bari is 170 Km. far from San Paolo di Civitate.

and for San Marco I think the most probable is San Marco Evangelista....
This is the complete list of the Communes of the Caserta Province:

http://www.comuni-italiani.it/061/lista.html

Ciao!
Laura :)

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Re: Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

Postby zitiello » 16 Oct 2007, 03:13

Wow! What great help you have been! Thank you.

I have discovered that the Carabba name is not very common and very hard to find information on. It seems to be the case as well with the Zitiello family name.

Although I haven't been researching that long, my sister has spent more time on our family heritage without too much information being discovered. Luckily, I have found some new websites, such as this one, which I hope will lead us to some more information about both families in Italy. Being that I am only the second generation to be in America, Italy is where our family history really rests.

Hopefully knowing the exact region that you have helped me to pinpoint will be a starting point for this exciting journey.

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Re: Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

Postby zitiello » 16 Oct 2007, 04:37

Just curious which site you used to look at the ship's manifest for my grandmother. It seems that you were able to gather more information than what I was able to decipher on the Ellis Island website.

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Re: Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

Postby BillieDeKid » 16 Oct 2007, 04:59

Hi Zitiello,

You can use ancestory, ellis island or stevemorse.org. All of them give you the same thing. steve morse site, gold form, gives you better search options (in my opinion).

Manifests before 1908 are usually only one page and don't have all the information that 1908 on has. I think you may have just missed a page. Here are both pages for Carabba

page 1
http://www.ellisisland.org/EIFile/popup ... &line=0027

page 2
http://www.ellisisland.org/EIFile/popup ... &line=0027

You'll see on page 1, line 27, Antoneta Carabba next to her name it says daughter and then faintly written over daughter is Carabba. The woman on line 26 is her mother.

On page 2 you'll see at line 26 it says husband and line 27 says father, go to the right and it list's Michele Carabba's name for the two of them along with his address.

Hope this helps.

Elizabeth

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Re: Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

Postby BillieDeKid » 16 Oct 2007, 05:09

Here is the manifest for Gabriele Zitiello

page 1
http://www.ellisisland.org/EIFile/popup ... &line=0011

page 2
http://www.ellisisland.org/EIFile/popup ... &line=0011

On page 2 if you look at the headings at the top of the columns it asks if the person had ever been here (USA) before and he said yes 1909 to 1913 so this was at least his second trip. Next to that it states where he was when he was last here.

You may already know this information but I thought I'd post it just in case.

Elizabeth

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Re: Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

Postby zitiello » 16 Oct 2007, 05:47

Elizabeth - thanks I was missing the second page for my grandmother's manifest. I'm also horrible at trying to read handwritings - lol.

I actually have the manifest for my grandfather that was given to my mother as a gift.

We know that my grandfather came to America at least twice if not three times.

The story goes like this...His father sends him to America to become an engineer which he hates so he returns to Italy. His father tells him he must return to America so he goes back and joins the American army for WWI. He is put onto a boat, gets shot almost immediately and is put back onto another boat back to America. Needless to say, he refused to ever get on another boat in his life (even a little motor boat). We aren't sure whether the last boat he took was part of the war or if he was back in Italy in between.

We have also figured out that he lied about his age at some point when entering America because the years he came here don't match up with the ages he states he was each time. We think it was so that he could join the army even though he was actually too young to do so.

There is also a possibility that he used the name Guiseppe instead of Gabriele on one or two of his trips to America.

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Re: Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

Postby pink67 » 16 Oct 2007, 06:53

Ciao Zitiello,

it's only a note but have you seen that also the surname Trentalancia (mother of Antoneta) is very very rare in Italy??

http://gens.labo.net/it/cognomi/genera.html

And I found this in the Apulia region:

Comuni nei quali è presente il cognome "Trentalancia" : 3 su 258.

5,68 Torremaggiore Foggia
3,21 Foggia Foggia
2,87 San Paolo di Civitate Foggia

Think this can be another confirmation about the town of your ancestors...
Ciao!
Laura :D

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Re: Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

Postby zitiello » 16 Oct 2007, 07:01

pink67 wrote:Ciao Zitiello,

it's only a note but have you seen that also the surname Trentalancia (mother of Antoneta) is very very rare in Italy??

Think this can be another confirmation about the town of your ancestors...
Ciao!
Laura :D


I did notice this when I went to that site earlier. I'm hoping that having rare names will help when I send off some letters for information. :D

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Re: Help with 2 areas: S. Marco, Caserta and S Paolo Cle

Postby zitiello » 16 Oct 2007, 22:43

I'm so excited! Today my sister gave me an envelope full of heritage items and in it was the Baptismal record for my grandmother. Seems that her name was spelled Carrabba in Italy instead of Carabba. It also confirms that she was from San Paolo Di Civitate.

I also have a certificate for my grandfather with the San Marco Evangelista on it.

Thanks for all your help trying to pinpoint the locations.


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