I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

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Re: I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

Postby Tessa78 » 07 Sep 2010, 19:31

Yes, she was "moglie di Giuseppe Polizzi" - wife of Giuseppe Polizzi...

Cause of death is usually not indicated in Italian morti...
No children mentioned in this document...

Neither witness has the last name Polizzi... it actually looks like it ends in "-monte"

And I agree with Peg, I think the age was 26. :-)


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Re: I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

Postby maestra36 » 07 Sep 2010, 19:36

Yes, monte is the ending of the surname of the second informant. Also I am sorry that I omitted that she was the wife of Giuseppe Polizzi. The Italian death records, as a rule, as T has stated, do not give a cause of death. In all of the years I have been working with these type of records, I have only seen one or two death records in which children of the deceased were listed.
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Re: I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

Postby maestra36 » 07 Sep 2010, 19:39

Some death records do state the relationship of the informants to the deceased. Sometimes it will say that the informant is a son, neighbor, or brother-in-law or son-in-law, etc of the deceased. Most death records, however, do not give the relationship of the informants to the deceased.
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Re: I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

Postby maestra36 » 07 Sep 2010, 19:49

The mayor's name looks like Francesco (followed by the abbreviation for Dottore) Scriffignano
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Re: I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

Postby trundo » 07 Sep 2010, 20:24

This is GREAT information.

Maestr36, I am learning alot from you and Tessa78.

I have a few more images I will upload later if I can't figure them out.


Thanks,

Tom
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Re: I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

Postby trundo » 08 Sep 2010, 02:37

I think I found the missing info to the Polizzi-Laueri maariage 4 pages earlier. They include Items# 4,5, and 6.
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Re: I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

Postby trundo » 08 Sep 2010, 02:57

Attached to this post:
Death record for Domenico Polizzi
Death record for Filippo Polizzi

It looks like Filippo died in 1780 and Domenico died in 1819. Am I correct? Can you tell me anything else about these 2 documents?


Thanks,


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Re: I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

Postby maestra36 » 08 Sep 2010, 09:39

There is no number 4 there. It starts with part of number 5, but the beginning of that is missing and I can only make out a few things for that number. I see S. Francesco, and I see the word for matrimony and a date of October (25 or 15) 1867. I also see Troino before the date.

Number 6 says "in the acts of death of the father and paternal grandfather of the bride (???). It looks like sposa and not sposo for bride and not groom, but I can't be sure, as there should be a similar statement for the groom

There are 4 witnesses listed on this page, but I will have to do some work on their surnames. Surnames in a town with which one is not familiar are the hardest things to decipher and take a lot of time and effort to decipher. So, if I can get to this later, I will.
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Re: I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

Postby maestra36 » 08 Sep 2010, 09:53

Domenico Polizzi-document is in Latin-
date of death looks like Oct 9, 1819 husband of Angela Pellizzeri. He had received all of the sacraments-buried in the ecclesia S. ?? (can't make it out). That's all I can decipher from the record. My Latin skills are extremely rusty, sorry.

Filippo Polizzi-document in Latin-
March 11 1780 at about age 72. He had received all of the sacraments and was buried in the ecclesia S. Lucia (not sure about Lucia). Dated in Troino the 26th of Oct 1847 for use for matrimony. Don't see any spouse listed for him in the record.
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Re: I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

Postby maestra36 » 08 Sep 2010, 09:56

marriage extraction 1-

#4 in the death acts of the father and grandfather of the groom

Can't read the beg part of #5
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Re: I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

Postby maestra36 » 08 Sep 2010, 12:33

witnesses on marriage document:
1. Francesco (sp?) it doesn't look like the full name to me. Can't make out his surname at all. He was age 36, a farmer, living in this town
2. Filippo Pistone, age 46, farmer living in the stated town
3. Pasquale Russo, age 30, armorer, living in the town
4. Antonino Bruno, age 23, farmer, living there

Normally witnesses in a marriage were known by, and produced by, the groom and bride but I don't see anything in this document which indicates that they produced them.
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Re: I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

Postby trundo » 08 Sep 2010, 14:40

Hi Peg,

From your first post... 'There is no number 4 there' The pages were uploaded in the wrong order. See marr_extraction_1 and then marr_extraction_2. You'll see at the bottom of marr_extraction_1 starts with 1, 2, 3, 4, and part of 5. Then on marr_extraction_2 you'll see the rest of 5, then 6, and 7.

WOW! I didn't know that the two death documents were in Latin. I was just figuring it was all in Italian. I appreciate you taking the time to figure those out.

What does it mean... '#4 in the death acts of the father and grandfather of the groom'? What is the death acts of the father and grandfather? Are there any names?

I do appreciate you looking at these documents. I am actually learning, from you, a little Italian as I look at the translations that you post.



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Re: I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

Postby maestra36 » 08 Sep 2010, 15:54

Tom
I understand that the pages were uploaded in the wrong order. That is not the problem. When I look at the page marriage extraction 2 and then marriage extraction 1, there is still info that was cut off. The top of marriage extraction 2, which is the first image above, starts in the middle of the information listed as number 5 of the list of documents required for the marriage. When you look at that next image you posted, number 5 starts at the very bottom but is cut off, so I can't read what it says. I can't read the first sentence of number 5 at the bottom of extraction 1 and I can't read the very top line(s) on the image before it (extraction 2). So I can't tell you exactly what required document was listed as the 5th required document and I can't I say with any certainly what information was provided under #5.

the #4 in the list of documents required for the marriage was the death acts of the father and the paternal grandfather of the groom. These two individuals were deceased at the time of the marriage and so the groom was required to present their death records as part of the list of the documents he was required to present for his marriage. Their names are not given nor are the names of the father and grandfather of the bride whose death acts were presented by her as number 6 in the list of the documents.

Tom, I hope you are following what I am telling you.

If you refer to the link which T provided above for record extractions, that will help you follow what is in these records. Also you may want to purchase a book by Trafford Cole on Italian Genealogical Records. It is advertised on this page on the left. He gives you examples of all kinds of records and complete explanations about what you find in them. He also provides translations.

Learning how to decipher and translate the script takes a lot of patience and practice. It is not something that will happen overnight but, if you keep at it, you will learn how to do it.

Peg
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Re: I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

Postby trundo » 08 Sep 2010, 17:38

Peg,

Thank you for all this information. I am actually ordering the book you recommended for my future needs. Once I get all these current documents translated and updated on Ancestry, I am going to start to work up my Family tree for my grandmother's side. The pages I have been uploading for help on the translation is my grandmothers father side. Then I have my grandfathers father and mother side. All Italian.

I will be uploading a few more images since the book will probably take 1-2 weeks and I am trying to get these documents done before of big Polizzi annual Family Reunion in the next week and a half.

Tom
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Re: I need help translating Serafino Polizzi Birth Record???

Postby trundo » 09 Sep 2010, 02:38

Hi Peg,

I have uploaded these two pages which I believe are consent documents for the marriage, but I am not sure. Can you help with deciphering these documents?

Thanks,


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