Sicilian DNA

Genetic genealogy is the application of genetics to traditional genealogy. Genetic genealogy involves the use of genealogical DNA testing to determine the level and type of the genetic relationship between individuals.
mjclayton1
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Re: Sicilian DNA

Post by mjclayton1 »

So, I've tested with both 23andMe and Ancestry separately. As others have stated, you can't upload raw data from one site to the other. As the two are the largest DNA platforms, no one should be surprised by this.

I think they both detected my Sicilian ancestry fairly well. I have one Italian ancestor - my maternal grandfather - who was born in Santa Lucia del Mela, Messina. Many related ancestors were from there and, more or less, equally so. from the nearby comune of Saponara, Messina. I have numerous civil records that trace to 5th generation Italian on this maternal grandfather's line.

Anyway, currently, 23andMe has me at 20.2% Southern European, which consists of:

Italian - 10.3%
Spanish & Portuguese -3.9%
Broadly Southern European - 6%
Total - 20.2%

Under the sub-heading for Italian, it further shows evidence of ancestry form multiple Administrative regions, the 1st being Sicily, the 2nd being Calabria, the 3rd being Apulia and so on. All told, not quite the "25%" that some incorrectly expect with a given grandparent, but I'm nonetheless satisfied with these numbers.

As for Ancestry, they show me as 12% Italian, with a "range" of 1%-14%. Not quite the percentages I think they should be, but originally they were 18% and, for whatever reason, were adjusted downward with the last update. However, they show the prime location as being San Marino, which I find curious (odd). I have to say, therefore, that I think 23andMe has fine-tuned" my Sicilian ancestry better here.

I do have quite a few Italian matches from both sites. My strongest match is at 23andMe (1.43% - probably a 2nd to 3rd cousin), but there are a few more total matches at Ancestry. Not too big a gap, tho', so I'm good with both sites in this regard.

it all therefore comes down to a personal choice. If I were you, I would say "do BOTH!!!"

:-)
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Edward Keeports
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Re: Sicilian DNA

Post by Edward Keeports »

In terms of deeper ancestral makeup (i.e. populations from Classical Antiquity and the Early Middle Ages), Sicilians are approximately
44% Middle Eastern and North African (mostly from Phoenician colonists and Arab/Berber conquerers, and to a lesser extent from converted Jews and Greek-speakers from Anatolia, Cyprus, and the Levant who settled in Sicily during Greek and Roman rule)
38% Mediterranean European (mostly ancient Italic and Hellenic people)
18% Northern European (In part from the Normans, but some of this also comes from Northern Italians who were settled in Sicily by the Normans to replace Arabs who were expelled for refusing to convert, and some is also probably from the Arbereshe Albanians, who have some Northeastern European DNA from the Slavic invasions of the Balkans during the Dark Ages)

I got these results with G25 Vahaduo: http://g25vahaduo.genetics.ovh/

It's a very good genetic calculator that has both ancient and modern samples, which means that unlike commercial DNA testing companies, which only go back 500 years or so, you can model modern populations using ancient and medieval samples.

Some other findings from G25 Vahaduo

- All Italians are part-Italic (i.e. descended from the ancient Italic speakers), but because there has been a lot of admixture from other groups, Italians form a genetic cline, not a genetic cluster. Calabrese are genetically equidistant between Lombards and Lebanese Christians, and Lombards are genetically equidistant between Calabrese and Northern French (from Calais).
Germany, which was also fragmented for many centuries and unified in the second half of the 19th century, is similar to Italy in this regard. In comparison, Spain, which has been unified since the Middle Ages, is much more genetically homogenous, in part because most southern Spaniards are the descendants of northern Spaniards who moved south with the Reconquista.
The British Isles are also fairly genetically homogenous, despite the long history of ethnic conflict between the English, Scottish and Irish, they are almost identical genetically.
- Italian Jews have far more Middle Eastern/North African DNA than any Catholic Italian group, which makes sense, since Jews originated in the Levant.
- Northern Italians have a high amount of Northern European DNA, probably because of the invasions of Northern Italy by various Germanic groups during and after the Fall of Rome.
- Venetians are about 16% Balto-Slavic from a genetic standpoint. At least some of this is from the Venetian Empire, which once ruled Dalmatia.
- People from the Aosta Valley are closer genetically to the French-speaking Swiss than they are to other Italians, which makes sense, since their native language is an Arpitan dialect, just like the Swiss dialect of French.
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Re: Sicilian DNA

Post by darkerhorse »

That's interesting information.
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Re: Sicilian DNA

Post by darkerhorse »

Has anyone had a DNA test for ethnicity which specifically names "Sicilian" as a category?
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Re: Sicilian DNA

Post by darkerhorse »

I guess none detect so specific.
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Re: Sicilian DNA

Post by mjclayton1 »

@darkerhorse The last update with 23andMe shows me as 25% Italian. Is correct in that I have a maternal grandfather that was born in Sicily (Province of Messina). When you dig deeper, 23andMe shows my Italian as a "Highly Likely Match". Further, it references evidence of my my top 8 Administrative Regions, with Sicily being No. 1. Not sure if that qualifies as a "category" for you, but it's as specific as it gets here.
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Re: Sicilian DNA

Post by darkerhorse »

Yes, administrative regions seems relevant. Does it means your closest matches had their tests done in Sicily?

Were percentages given to your top 8?
mjclayton1
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Re: Sicilian DNA

Post by mjclayton1 »

They don’t show where the tests were done, nor do they give percentages for the top 8. I have verified paperwork for Sicily ancestry (Santa Lucia del Mela and Saponara) that go to many 3rd and 4th great grandparents (luckily for me, Antenati records in those comuni are quite good).

There are some DNA explanations on 23andMe. If you have Shared DNA in the Relatives In Common table then it’s likely you descend from a recent common ancestor. Still, no breakdowns of specific areas.
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Re: Sicilian DNA

Post by darkerhorse »

Does anyone with Sicilian ancestry have a Y haplogroup which is traced back to the British Isles, specifically to Scotland?
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Re: Sicilian DNA

Post by afecad »

I have both, but the Scottish is on my Paternal side. My Maternal side has the Italian, with some Sicilian but mostly Calabrian.
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Re: Sicilian DNA

Post by darkerhorse »

I'm looking for Scottish to Sicilian migration in the direct paternal line.
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Re: Sicilian DNA

Post by afecad »

darkerhorse wrote: 01 Mar 2021, 00:41 I'm looking for Scottish to Sicilian migration in the direct paternal line.
As previously mentioned, the Romans invaded the British Isles, including Scotland 2000 years ago so, which makes sense.

There is a Sicilian group on FamilyTreeDNA, suggest you reach out to them or join the group after DNA testing through FamilyTreeDNA.

https://www.familytreedna.com/groups/si ... ivity-feed
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Re: Sicilian DNA

Post by darkerhorse »

I'm looking for the reverse, Scots migrating to Sicily.
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Re: Sicilian DNA

Post by MarcuccioV »

My Ancestry report showed me with a majority of Southern Italian (I'm 50% Italian on my mother's side). i've uploaded my results to various other sites which show me with relatively high concentrations of SW Asia and South Caucasus (Arabic and Armenian) as well as Baltic. Although my recent (1800's) relatives are all from Lazio, my grandfather was dark complected and more "Mediterranean" featured, so I'm assuming he likely has unknown Sicilian roots as most Sicilians will have high concentrations of Arabic/Greek (southern Baltic)...
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Re: Sicilian DNA

Post by afecad »

MarcuccioV wrote: 03 Mar 2021, 00:45 My Ancestry report showed me with a majority of Southern Italian (I'm 50% Italian on my mother's side). i've uploaded my results to various other sites which show me with relatively high concentrations of SW Asia and South Caucasus (Arabic and Armenian) as well as Baltic. Although my recent (1800's) relatives are all from Lazio, my grandfather was dark complected and more "Mediterranean" featured, so I'm assuming he likely has unknown Sicilian roots as most Sicilians will have high concentrations of Arabic/Greek (southern Baltic)...
Mine is similar on my maternal side, but of the three DNA tests and free sites I uploaded my data to, I see differences and some go farther, one notes "Mali" heritage while another does not. I do see a small % between all in North Africa, I'm positive this is from my maternal line.
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