Ethnic Origin of Italians

[aristides]

I am giving a lecture on Italian heritage and genealogy. I am looking for a scholarly paper on the ethnic origin of Italians. Can anyone point me in the right direction? I am always grateful for your assistance.

[johnnyonthespot]

You might find some useful references in this recent thread: http://www.italiangenealogy.com/Forums/ ... 14127.html

[PeterTimber]

aristedes since your obviously Greek oriented but did not disclose the parameters of your lecture and while the referral to a previous discussion on the subject is sound you might be able to take full advantage of this website at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Italy

Should you have any additonal questions please advise us. =Peter=

[seabreezes1]

The melanin production for southern peoples is somewhat overstated. That's not something that happens in a few hundred, or even a thousand years. In my own Sicilian family of origin, there are blonde & blue eyed siblings, swarthy siblings, and olive skin toned blondes. The really interesting thing about Sicily is that it is truly a melting pot of African, Semitic, Germanic & Scandinavian genes - amongst others. My Dad and his two brothers were dark and looked very much alike, except my Dad had a Latin nose, one uncle had a broader nose (African), and the third had a very hooked nose (Semitic.) And there are a LOT of red-haired Sicilians. The thing I delight in is DNA studies in Sicily have shown it to be very homogeneous in its heterogeneousness - a real family of man. Follow all the links on this page: http://www.bestofsicily.com/history1.htm#people

[PeterTimber]

Dear Seabreezes ethnicity relates to country of origin not skin color or physical attributes. The Hellenes from Greece settled most of Sicily and Southern Italy starting 2500 years ago. =Peter=

[seabreezes1]

Hi Peter,
Agreed. I was following the links referenced in the previous emails which went on about skin color, etc. and kind of responded to them in this thread.

Frankly, I think race is somewhat of a ridiculous concept. We all came out of Africa originally. However different pockets of humanity did develop characteristics that ultimately were linked to their nation of origin - their ethnic identity. And the historical and cultural stories of those countries are what is most interesting. I know that I have ancestors who both succumbed to and survived the 1630 Plague of Milan because of the town they were living in, and I have "The Betrothed" which tells me a lot of what it was like then. I discovered an aunt who was first an orphan then a nun with Blessed Father Giacomo Cusmano in Palermo 1870s onward. From his history, I know something of her life. Isn't that the appeal of genealogy? Tracing those tiny clues to places that have stories that resonate?
Best~

[PeterTimber]

I heartily concur with you. I traced back my family surname tothe 1100's and in doing so I did come across resonate accounts of people places and things. In fact just a few days ago I discovered that one of my family participated (its a whole story ) in a war in the 1400's that another person here in the forum in his family searches participated in the same war but from different places, events, social standing, activity in Basilicata and the other in Sicily and that gave me cause to pause ! =Nice to meet up with you. =Peter=

[lngrid]

Hi, Peter.

Your comment reminded me of something I found in my own family history that gave me a chuckle. In the early Middle Ages a branch of my grandfather's Norwegian family was of minor nobility in Belgium. His wife, my grandmother, has an ancestor who was an ancestor of William the Conqueror and who raided and pretty much devastated the estates of this Belgian "baron." I came across the written account of it while I was tracing back the family name and enjoyed the irony immensely.

My grandparents were happily married for 60 years. Honest. *wink*

[PeterTimber]

What goes around comes around thats for sure. =Peter=

[Italianthro]

Italians have the same ancestry as other Europeans, just in different proportions. They're basically a mix of Neolithic farmers and Bronze Age Indo-Europeans (Italic, Greek, Celtic, Illyrian). Later admixture from other sources has been negligible.

http://italianthro.blogspot.com/2017/04 ... cture.html

[ToniR]

After moving to Italy 2years ago to the same town where my GGM and GGGM were born, I discovered that the area (Taranto/Leporano) was settled by a group of Spartans after the betrayal of the Athenians. The people of that region are very proud of their Spartan heritage. There’s a wonderful museum in Taranto with Spartan artifacts, and I took an underground tour of the city that the historian leading the tour says were the foundations built by the Spartans. And the columns of Hercules are still standing above ground. The symbol of Taranto is Tara’s riding a dolphin (oracle of Delphi). It’s fascinating history, and I had no idea about it before moving there. So, this has become part of my family history.

Agree, the culture and stories are the best part of research.

[BLAIRS]

Decent, need to accomplish something like this with mine.

[Palermo Trapani]

Aristedes:

I would recommend you find the recent empirical scholarship on Italian DNA studies. There are lots of trolls out there that like to play the otherness of Southerners (Campania, Puglia, Calabria, Basilicata and Sicily). I would recommend two recent DNA studies

1) Sazzinni et al. (2016)

https://www.nature.com/articles/srep32513

2). Raveane et al (2019)

https://advances.sciencemag.org/content/5/9/eaaw3492

Figure 2 in both papers provides a clear concise overview of Italian Source populations. Both papers show clear clusters, 1) Sardinia is by itself as Raveane et al. (2019) indicate it is > 80% Early European Farmer DNA. The other clusters are 2)Sicily-South Italy (South of Rome), 3) Central Italy (Lazio, Abbruzo, Umbria, etc) and 4) North Italy.

Interestingly, both studies suggest that outside of Tuscany, Central Italy (Rome, Umbria, Abruzzo) actually cluster closer with the South. Tuscany seems to cluster very closely with Corsica and seems to be unique but overall a little closer to the North.