Map Translation

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darkerhorse
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Map Translation

Post by darkerhorse »

I'm looking for the translation of a phrase on a 19th century map of Sicily.

https://maps.arcanum.com/en/map/italy-1 ... &layers=20

It looks like "C. da Radiu di Melilli".

The town of Melilli is nearby, to the southeast.
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mmogno
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Re: Map Translation

Post by mmogno »

C.da = Contrada
darkerhorse
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Re: Map Translation

Post by darkerhorse »

Thanks.

I know di Melilli means of Melilli (the town), and da is from. Is Radiu a surname? I don't see Radiu used as a surname in Melilli. It sounds like radius.
AngelaGrace56
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Re: Map Translation

Post by AngelaGrace56 »

darkerhorse wrote: 02 May 2021, 17:05 Thanks.

I know di Melilli means of Melilli (the town), and da is from. Is Radiu a surname? I don't see Radiu used as a surname in Melilli. It sounds like radius.


Following on from what mmogno has said, "C.da" is an abbreviation for the word "Contrada". Contrada was basically a district/area of Melilli. Maybe today we might call it a suburb.

Anyways I'm reading "Contrada Radia di Melilli" This might help you research further.

Angela
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mmogno
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Re: Map Translation

Post by mmogno »

AngelaGrace56 wrote: 02 May 2021, 22:03
darkerhorse wrote: 02 May 2021, 17:05 Thanks.

I know di Melilli means of Melilli (the town), and da is from. Is Radiu a surname? I don't see Radiu used as a surname in Melilli. It sounds like radius.


Following on from what mmogno has said, "C.da" is an abbreviation for the word "Contrada". Contrada was basically a district/area of Melilli. Maybe today we might call it a suburb.

Anyways I'm reading "Contrada Radia di Melilli" This might help you research further.

Angela
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Potrebbe essere "Contrada Badia di Melilli"?
darkerhorse
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Re: Map Translation

Post by darkerhorse »

Google translates badia as abbey. I know there was a Capuchin convent for men in Melilli.
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Re: Map Translation

Post by AngelaGrace56 »

mmogno wrote: 02 May 2021, 23:04
AngelaGrace56 wrote: 02 May 2021, 22:03
darkerhorse wrote: 02 May 2021, 17:05 Thanks.

I know di Melilli means of Melilli (the town), and da is from. Is Radiu a surname? I don't see Radiu used as a surname in Melilli. It sounds like radius.


Following on from what mmogno has said, "C.da" is an abbreviation for the word "Contrada". Contrada was basically a district/area of Melilli. Maybe today we might call it a suburb.

Anyways I'm reading "Contrada Radia di Melilli" This might help you research further.

Angela
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Potrebbe essere "Contrada Badia di Melilli"?

Ciao G

I had wondered that too when I looked at it this earlier today. It is certainly shaped more like a B than an R. (It's just an incomplete B). I've just had another look at the map and had a quick search. I see that Bardia appears in various Provinces of Sicily as either a street name, the name of a Church, a Villa etc. The name certainly has it's presence there.

Angela
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Re: Map Translation

Post by AngelaGrace56 »

AngelaGrace56 wrote: 03 May 2021, 05:15
mmogno wrote: 02 May 2021, 23:04
AngelaGrace56 wrote: 02 May 2021, 22:03



Following on from what mmogno has said, "C.da" is an abbreviation for the word "Contrada". Contrada was basically a district/area of Melilli. Maybe today we might call it a suburb.

Anyways I'm reading "Contrada Radia di Melilli" This might help you research further.

Angela
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Potrebbe essere "Contrada Badia di Melilli"?

Ciao G

I had wondered that too when I looked at this earlier today. It is certainly shaped more like a B than an R. (It's just an incomplete B). I've just had another look at the map and had a quick search. I see that Badia appears in various Provinces of Sicily as either a street name, the name of a Church, a Villa etc. The name certainly has it's presence there.

Angela
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Re: Map Translation

Post by bbivona »

AngelaGrace56 wrote: 03 May 2021, 05:15
mmogno wrote: 02 May 2021, 23:04
AngelaGrace56 wrote: 02 May 2021, 22:03

Following on from what mmogno has said, "C.da" is an abbreviation for the word "Contrada". Contrada was basically a district/area of Melilli. Maybe today we might call it a suburb.

Anyways I'm reading "Contrada Radia di Melilli" This might help you research further.

Angela
@AngelaGrace56
Potrebbe essere "Contrada Badia di Melilli"?

Ciao G

I had wondered that too when I looked at it this earlier today. It is certainly shaped more like a B than an R. (It's just an incomplete B). I've just had another look at the map and had a quick search. I see that Bardia appears in various Provinces of Sicily as either a street name, the name of a Church, a Villa etc. The name certainly has it's presence there.

Angela

A badia is an abbey, where monks or nuns live, so you'll see the references to the badia and sometimes to the associated church, for example, la Chiesa della Badia di Sant'Agata. More broadly it can also just mean a comfortable place for a traveler, so you'll see it the name on things like B&Bs, etc. I think of a contrada (C.da) of as a district. My house in Sicily is always described as in C.da XXXX, but there is nothing recognizable as a community. It's just an area with a few small farms, a few businesses, some houses, but all pretty much random - no concentration of anything and you can't tell where it starts or stops.
Researching Gibellina, Sicily surnames Bivona, Bonafede, Zummo, Ponzio, Bevinetto, Beninati, Fontana, Cipolla, Bruno, Manfrè, Lanfranca, and Navarra
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joetucciarone
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Re: Map Translation

Post by joetucciarone »

Thanks for all of these interpretations; they make this map easier to understand. I've noticed the abbreviation "Re." used throughout the southern peninsula. Examples: "Re. Palladino" and "Re. Ippolito." An Italian friend said
"Re." might be an abbreviation for "regione." That makes sense; "Ippolito" is a surname, so "Re. Ippolito" might be "the Ippolito family's neighborhood." I haven't seen "Re." anywhere on Sicily (yet) so maybe the Sicilians didn't use it. Can anyone verify this?
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Re: Map Translation

Post by darkerhorse »

Is there a way to identify the boundaries of the town of Melilli on this map?
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Re: Map Translation

Post by bbivona »

joetucciarone wrote: 03 May 2021, 12:45 Thanks for all of these interpretations; they make this map easier to understand. I've noticed the abbreviation "Re." used throughout the southern peninsula. Examples: "Re. Palladino" and "Re. Ippolito." An Italian friend said
"Re." might be an abbreviation for "regione." That makes sense; "Ippolito" is a surname, so "Re. Ippolito" might be "the Ippolito family's neighborhood." I haven't seen "Re." anywhere on Sicily (yet) so maybe the Sicilians didn't use it. Can anyone verify this?
I think it's region. Looking at some of the names with the "re." designation in Calabria and Basilicata, most of those seem to have contrada designation on modern maps. I found a book from 1895 called Descrizione Geologica della Calabria and it refers to some of the same areas as regions. My understanding of these designations is the the cartographers were supposed to give deference to the local names, so it may be a regione some places and a contrada in others. "Re." was definitely used in Sicily at the time. You can see quite a few of them here around Poggioreale, Salaparuta, and Gibellina. Some of the names may be related to family land holdings, but I see quite a few that are tied to geographic features.
https://maps.arcanum.com/en/map/italy-1 ... &layers=20
Researching Gibellina, Sicily surnames Bivona, Bonafede, Zummo, Ponzio, Bevinetto, Beninati, Fontana, Cipolla, Bruno, Manfrè, Lanfranca, and Navarra
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Re: Map Translation

Post by bbivona »

darkerhorse wrote: 03 May 2021, 12:55 Is there a way to identify the boundaries of the town of Melilli on this map?

Not with a specific designation of the city limits, but you can see the streets of the town laid out and the blackened areas between the streets. That's going to be the town at that time. You can see today it still has the same geographic footprint, plus a little growth to the southeast. Its limits were pretty much set by its geography.
https://www.google.com/maps/place/96010 ... 15.1253159

The comune of Melleli is larger. Current map
https://www.citypopulation.de/en/italy/ ... __melilli/
A number of years ago it would have also included what's now the comune of Priolo Gargallo. The current Mellili comune boundaries are broken up with Priolo Gargallo in between.
https://www.portaleabruzzo.com/sicilia/ ... llo/mappa/
Researching Gibellina, Sicily surnames Bivona, Bonafede, Zummo, Ponzio, Bevinetto, Beninati, Fontana, Cipolla, Bruno, Manfrè, Lanfranca, and Navarra
darkerhorse
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Re: Map Translation

Post by darkerhorse »

I'm familiar with the current town, but these maps are helpful.
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