Rimo or Rimen in the Duchy of Milan

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Rimo or Rimen in the Duchy of Milan

Post by Felber » 12 Sep 2015, 17:55


I‘m trying to locate a village which is called „Rimo“ or „Rimen“. It is located in the Duchy of Milan. The name only occurs in two german entries from the year 1567 and 1573. I’m thankful for every hint. The only place that I found which would be possible is Rima San Giuseppe. What do you think? If it helps, I could upload the original entries, but I'm quite sure about the spelling of the place.

Some inforamtion regarding my family: An ancestor of mine, Johann Hänsli and his two brothers Peter and Ulrich emigrated to the Canton Lucerne before 1567. Peter and Ulrich lived in Hergiswil, Johann later moved to Romoos before 1573. The spelling „Hänsli“ came up later, the first mentionings of the family were Hantzelo, Hanlins or Hentzli. The form „Hantzelo“ was the first one and I think that it might be identical with the name „Angelo“, which was changed a lot in the german language (first to Hantzelo and later to Hänsli).

Thanks in advance!

Kind regards

Olivier Felber

Posts: 398
Joined: 12 Oct 2014, 22:37
Location: Canada

Re: Rimo or Rimen in the Duchy of Milan

Post by Anizio » 15 Sep 2015, 02:33

Yes upload the original entries. Place names evolve, so we don't need a modern place named Rimo or Rimen, we need a place that would have been called that around 1600. Keep in mind you could also be looking for a small town (frazione) which would be harder to locate.

It also helps to search in other languages. Rimen sounds like a German name for the town.
Rima could be it, its possible you misread an a for an o (which is why always post the original) Rima, the frazione of Rima San Giuseppe, is what you want because Rima was always Rima but until the 1800s Rima San Giuseppe was just called San Giuseppe.

Rima is the only place I can find, that may have fallen under the Duchy of Milan around that time period, that comes close to anything you mentioned. It was also founded by the Walser/Valsesi/Wallis people who's language was closer to German so it would make sense, at least in the 1500s, that there could be a German presence alongside an Italian presence.

Of course that's all speculation. Share the original documents and maybe some of us can help more. That said the three towns mentioned are all close together in what in now central Switzerland, and Rima is far from them making it less likely, but still possible.

I also find a few references in the german language to a place called Rimen in 1800s Swiss books, suggesting it is in Switzerland. But wherever it is, I can't seem to find it on any current maps or lists.
TIP: When asking for records from Italy, do NOT ask for an "estratto." ALWAYS ask for a "copia integrale." A photocopy of the original Act will contain more information

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Joined: 12 Sep 2015, 17:46

Re: Rimo or Rimen in the Duchy of Milan

Post by Felber » 15 Sep 2015, 11:20

Thank you Anizio for the fast and helpful reply!

It's probably a small place, because in the second entry the place is called "Dorff", which means "village".

The writing isn't that clear, it could be "Rima" instead of "Rimo", but I would read the last letter rather as an "o", because it's just like the "o" from "von" before. But the writers back then weren't that precise with the name of locations, especially when the origin was of another language.

For sure, Rima would be far away from the places they moved on later. But the place - whether it's Rima or not - definitely was in the Duchy of Milan. And the part with the Walser would make sense, because the language is much closer to the german than italian would be.

Have you more information about that place "Rimen"? I've found a Rimen Gart in Rorschach, St. Gallen, but that could be excluded since it wasn't part of the Duchy of Milan.

Here are the original Entries with the transcriptions I've made. I've marked the place of origin bold, so that it's easier to find. Below each entry there's also a translation of the important parts:
Petter Hantzelo und Uli Hantzelo me
gnept Hanlins Peter und Hanlins Uli,
uss Willisower Ampt uff dem Hof a Salo
in Willisower Ampt, von Rimo uss dem
Hertzogtum Meÿlandt
pürttig, ir Udell
ist Hanns gemell zuo (?)wÿl, hetts
Herre Vogt Henserlin globt uff Mon-
tag vor Allerheligentag, Anno 1567
Translation: Peter Hantzelo and Ulrich Hantzelo, called Hanlins Peter and Hanlins Ulrich from the department Willisau, on the farm Salo in the department Willisau, native from Rimo in the Duchy of Milan. […] 1567.
Hans Henseli von Meÿlandt im
dorff Rÿmen in Meÿlander Gebiet
so hinder Pedter Hensli sinem Bruder
im Ampt Willisow gesessen, und züche
jetz ins Landt Entlibuch gan Romoss
Ist zum hindersäss angenomen word
hat zallt xx gl und geschworen
uff Sampstag vor Quasimodo A° 1573
Translation: Johann Henseli from Milan, the village Rymen in the area of Milan, living with his brother Peter Hensli in the department Willisau, moved now to Romoos in the department Entlebuch. […] 1573.

Kind regards

Olivier Felber
Entry from 1567
Entry from 1573

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