What is the document number in this index

Are you looking for an Italian surname? Do you need more information about your family heritage?
This is the right place to start your genealogy search.
User avatar
rp76226
Master
Master
Posts: 1968
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 17:00

What is the document number in this index

Post by rp76226 »

Under L.B. in this index lists the death of Bernarda Leggio. I can't figure out what the record number is and thus cannot find the death record (each line in the index seems to cover two pages). I've tried 129 and 60 and 20. Here is the link:

http://dl.antenati.san.beniculturali.it ... ewsIndex=0
paola52
Elite
Elite
Posts: 425
Joined: 24 Sep 2012, 13:47
Location: Varese, Italy

Re: What is the document number in this index

Post by paola52 »

I read centoventotto -128
P.
Researching Provinces of Varese, Como and Milan and the valleys around Turin
User avatar
rp76226
Master
Master
Posts: 1968
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 17:00

Re: What is the document number in this index

Post by rp76226 »

That's a death record for a different person than is listed in the index so that can't be right.

http://dl.antenati.san.beniculturali.it ... 6.jpg.html
AngelaGrace56
Master
Master
Posts: 7084
Joined: 16 Oct 2012, 10:54

Re: What is the document number in this index

Post by AngelaGrace56 »

Ron and Paola, I'm sure that the numbers in the left column are just keeping a tally. They are not the Act No, so you have to go by the date. I had a quick look through July but didn't find it so I think that they have made an error. The indices are fantastic though because they give you so much information - parents names, husband's name, her age. Sorry I've got visitors in a minute so can't look any further. You may need to go page by page unless Paola can see something that I'm missing.

Angela
paola52
Elite
Elite
Posts: 425
Joined: 24 Sep 2012, 13:47
Location: Varese, Italy

Re: What is the document number in this index

Post by paola52 »

http://dl.antenati.san.beniculturali.it ... ewsIndex=0
Maybe this is the answer
First page of the index
Names of the people who died during the cholera epidemic and who were not registered as usual by the Stato Civile.
The list was made using information given by relatives and neighbors
Paola
Researching Provinces of Varese, Como and Milan and the valleys around Turin
User avatar
MarcuccioV
Master
Master
Posts: 1736
Joined: 11 Jan 2021, 17:49
Location: West Hills, CA USA

Re: What is the document number in this index

Post by MarcuccioV »

rp76226 wrote: 24 Oct 2021, 20:57 That's a death record for a different person than is listed in the index so that can't be right.

http://dl.antenati.san.beniculturali.it ... 6.jpg.html
It's definitely 128. They are numbered in order, the one before is 127 (centoventisette) & the one after 129 (centoventinove). I have seen these messed up before. Occasionally the "ordine" and pagina" are switched. I had the same issue while researching a name in Calabritto, Avellino. I finally found the record I was seeking.

However there is no doubt as to the # in the index. It IS 128...
Mark

If you ignore your foundation, your house will eventually collapse...

Surnames: Attiani Belli Bucci Calvano Cerci DelBrusco Falera Latini Marsili Mattia Mezzo Nardecchia Pellegrini Piacentini Pizzuti Pontecorvo Recchia Topani Ziantona & Zorli
User avatar
rp76226
Master
Master
Posts: 1968
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 17:00

Re: What is the document number in this index

Post by rp76226 »

All they are doing is numbering the entries in numerical order (1, 2, 3, etc.) which are actually controlled by the first letter of the surname first and the first letter of the first name second. 128 is meaningless in terms of identifying the document number where the actual death record is located. It is merely the 128th index entry. There is no way that numerical order of the document numbers would perfectly line up with the alphabetical order of the surnames of the deceased. That would mean that everyone that year died in alphabetical order. Impossible!

Ron
AngelaGrace56
Master
Master
Posts: 7084
Joined: 16 Oct 2012, 10:54

Re: What is the document number in this index

Post by AngelaGrace56 »

paola52 wrote: 24 Oct 2021, 21:20 http://dl.antenati.san.beniculturali.it ... ewsIndex=0
Maybe this is the answer
First page of the index
Names of the people who died during the cholera epidemic and who were not registered as usual by the Stato Civile.
The list was made using information given by relatives and neighbors
Paola

Yes, this is the answer. Great catch Paola. I was going to take another look through the July deaths and further but won't have to now. Grazie. I had a feeling there had to be more to it because the indices include so much info.

Angela
AngelaGrace56
Master
Master
Posts: 7084
Joined: 16 Oct 2012, 10:54

Re: What is the document number in this index

Post by AngelaGrace56 »

rp76226 wrote: 24 Oct 2021, 19:02 Under L.B. in this index lists the death of Bernarda Leggio. I can't figure out what the record number is and thus cannot find the death record (each line in the index seems to cover two pages). I've tried 129 and 60 and 20. Here is the link:

http://dl.antenati.san.beniculturali.it ... ewsIndex=0

So, following on from Paola's post, it appears that there arn't Civil Death Records for those who lost their lives during the Cholera Epidemic. If it helps, here is the info from Bernarda's death entry from the link you've posted. The writing isn't the best so hopefully someone else will take a look as well.


Bernarda Leggio, was 60 yo, a filandiera (spinner/weaver) born in Corleone, living in Via San Giuliano, the wife of Tommaso Vintaloro, daughter of the deceased Nicolo and the deceased Francesca Birtone? She died 28? July at 2 pm in her own home.

Angela
User avatar
rp76226
Master
Master
Posts: 1968
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 17:00

Re: What is the document number in this index

Post by rp76226 »

Thank you. She's about the right age of the person I am looking for. However, my Bernarda Leggio was married to Francesco Bartolotta. Could still be her, if he died and she re-married, but I haven't found his death certificate. Her children (two boys and two girls) don't match the parents names given in this index, so probably not her.
AngelaGrace56
Master
Master
Posts: 7084
Joined: 16 Oct 2012, 10:54

Re: What is the document number in this index

Post by AngelaGrace56 »

rp76226 wrote: 25 Oct 2021, 09:39 Thank you. She's about the right age of the person I am looking for. However, my Bernarda Leggio was married to Francesco Bartolotta. Could still be her, if he died and she re-married, but I haven't found his death certificate. Her children (two boys and two girls) don't match the parents names given in this index, so probably not her.

Just following up here, as I've had a little spare time today. I've located the 1840 marriage of Francesco Bartolotta and Bernarda Liggio's son Giuseppe. It looks they were both still alive in 1840.

1840 Marriage: Giuseppe Bartolotta, 24 yo, son of Francesco Bartolotta, 46 yo and Bernarda Liggio, 47 yo.
http://dl.antenati.san.beniculturali.it ... ewsIndex=0

Surname: Leggio/Liggio?

Angela
User avatar
rp76226
Master
Master
Posts: 1968
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 17:00

Re: What is the document number in this index

Post by rp76226 »

Thanks Angela. I'm having difficulty with the spelling of the bride's surname (Cali?) and the bride's mother's first and last name Jemmula? Casiaggi?
Also, on pages 2 to 4, is there any grandparent information?
User avatar
rp76226
Master
Master
Posts: 1968
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 17:00

Re: What is the document number in this index

Post by rp76226 »

Angela, one other issue. I know that ages on civil records are often guesses by witnesses. The ages of the groom's parents of 46 and 47 (implying births in 1794 and 1793) seem to be too young as they had children in 1805, 1807, and 1810.
AngelaGrace56
Master
Master
Posts: 7084
Joined: 16 Oct 2012, 10:54

Re: What is the document number in this index

Post by AngelaGrace56 »

rp76226 wrote: 28 Oct 2021, 14:11 Thanks Angela. I'm having difficulty with the spelling of the bride's surname (Cali?) and the bride's mother's first and last name Jemmula? Casiaggi?
Also, on pages 2 to 4, is there any grandparent information?

Here are the bride's details:

Bride: Lucia Cali, never married, 18 yo, born in Corleone, living therein, daughter of Innoccenzio Cali, 50 yo, farmer, living therein, and of the deceased Rosa Iemmula, (married couple) 40 yo, who had lived therein when living. (So mother would’ve died when she was 40.)

(It's the second time I have come across the surname Cali' this week. I came across it in the town of Marineo, a short distance from Corleone.)

No there is no other information about the grandparents. It looks like the father of the bride was unable to locate a document but it's not clearly written what document.

I'll get back to you re your other question. Just need to check something.

Angela
User avatar
rp76226
Master
Master
Posts: 1968
Joined: 27 Apr 2010, 17:00

Re: What is the document number in this index

Post by rp76226 »

As far as age of parents, here is an 1827 marriage of the child Brigitta Bartolotta, that based on her parents' ages in 1827, would suggest much earlier birth years for them:

http://dl.antenati.san.beniculturali.it ... 6.jpg.html
Post Reply