Ethnicity vs. skin tone

Genetic genealogy is the application of genetics to traditional genealogy. Genetic genealogy involves the use of genealogical DNA testing to determine the level and type of the genetic relationship between individuals.
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MarcuccioV
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Re: Ethnicity vs. skin tone

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darkerhorse wrote: 12 Oct 2021, 04:56 As I recall, the significance of your father's olive skin was that it might suggest hidden Italian ancestry. Have you found any?
I haven't had much time to look. Since I have other Med ethnicities as well, so I suppose the possibility exists that it could be one of those also, albeit more remote.

It just doesn't jive with what is on paper nor with at least SOME of the known ancestors which are very light or pinkish-skinned.

Just where or when the olive skin was introduced on his side still eludes me. It would not behoove me to rule out anything with regards to HIS ancestors, including undocumented adoption, illegitimacy or even, sadly, an assault scenario...
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Re: Ethnicity vs. skin tone

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I also have a considerable number of at least partially-Italian DNA matches that I cannot tie to my maternal grandparents, either by surname, region, marriage or otherwise.

So that's another mystery in and of itself. Are they related to my mother's side..? If so, why no connection..? They can't be too terribly deep in the tree as some have predicted relationships in the 3rd-5th cousin range...

I also have to entertain the chance that I may never find the answers I seek... :(
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Re: Ethnicity vs. skin tone

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Or, it could be a wild goose chase.

His skin complexion could very well have come from ancestors already identified. Just the result of natural genetics.
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Re: Ethnicity vs. skin tone

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I think that's at least as plausible as some of the scenarios you suggested.

Anyway, how extensive are your photos of his direct ancestors and his extended family?

I suppose odds are that olive skin should also being showing up somewhere else in his (biological) family tree.

If you did find a mystery ancestor from the clue of olive skin then that would make a good story for a genealogy magazine. Have you searched them to see if someone else has had a similar experience?
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Re: Ethnicity vs. skin tone

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darkerhorse wrote: 12 Oct 2021, 16:15 I think that's at least as plausible as some of the scenarios you suggested.

Anyway, how extensive are your photos of his direct ancestors and his extended family?

I suppose odds are that olive skin should also being showing up somewhere else in his (biological) family tree.

If you did find a mystery ancestor from the clue of olive skin then that would make a good story for a genealogy magazine. Have you searched them to see if someone else has had a similar experience?
I have very few family photos to make comparisons with; those that I do have are of no help. All I can say is I can't find anything based upon the paper trail. I have looked for misinformation or red herrings there, but so far nothing has jumped out at me.

I have not looked into any articles on a similar subject. No time at the present, but hopefully I can do more over the winter...
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Re: Ethnicity vs. skin tone

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If there was some such intrigue in your family you'd think there'd be something suggestive that you'd have already come across in the family tree, documents, family lore, DNA matching, etc.

FYI
https://www.ancestry.com/lp/traits/skin-pigmentation
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Re: Ethnicity vs. skin tone

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darkerhorse wrote: 12 Oct 2021, 19:54 If there was some such intrigue in your family you'd think there'd be something suggestive that you'd have already come across in the family tree, documents, family lore, DNA matching, etc.

FYI
https://www.ancestry.com/lp/traits/skin-pigmentation
I think I mentioned before that there was family lore about there being Indigenous American (my GGm Anna, daughter of the aforementioned Frank Morris). However not a single matrix I've uploaded to gives me even a trace of Native ancestry.

Aside from that I have nothing. They were either not a communicative family or they were good at keeping secrets they didn't ever want exposed. No one (including my one living uncle) can shed ANY light on the subject.

If something happened that the family wanted buried, they must have dug an extremely deep hole. All I've been able to do is scratch the surface...
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Re: Ethnicity vs. skin tone

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I don't recall the Native American family lore but I suppose that could account for it.

Would any of your paternal relatives spring for the Ancestry skin pigment analysis?

Pantone identifies 110 skin tones!
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Re: Ethnicity vs. skin tone

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darkerhorse wrote: 13 Oct 2021, 03:03 I don't recall the Native American family lore but I suppose that could account for it.

Would any of your paternal relatives spring for the Ancestry skin pigment analysis?

Pantone identifies 110 skin tones!
I don't know but I suppose I could ask. So far they haven't even done DNA except 2 1st cousins & my illegitimate cousin...
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Re: Ethnicity vs. skin tone

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This part sounded of interest.

"Have you ever wondered how you inherited your unique skin tone? An AncestryDNA® test can tell you more about your genes and your skin pigmentation."
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Re: Ethnicity vs. skin tone

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What was your father's eye color?
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Re: Ethnicity vs. skin tone

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darkerhorse wrote: 14 Oct 2021, 00:14 What was your father's eye color?
Dark brown, almost black. The other two olive-skinned brothers were the same. Not sure on the oldest brother. Youngest is lighter skinned, blonde-haired & blue-eyed.
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Re: Ethnicity vs. skin tone

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I was thinking that you might be able to infer something from the eye color of your father, his parents, and his grandparents - whether they were his biological parents - but I just read that the single gene theory is old genetics. Today, it's believed that eye color comes from multiple genes, and is more a blend or continuum. So, there are eye color probabilities but not really eye color anomalies.

Here's an eye color calculator.

https://pregnantchicken.com/baby-eye-color-predictor/

Let e know if you find a low eye color probability for your father or his (presumed) siblings.

In my family, I have brown eyes (66% odds), one sibling has blue eyes (17% odds), and the other has hazel eyes (17% odds).

By the way, the woman who cut my hair today remarked that I have "Italian skin". She's Italian too but fair-skinned with blue undertones, no hint of olive. We compared hands - my veins first looked bluish green to her until we compared them to hers which were greenish blue. Next to hers, mine clearly looked green. I think without the residual summer tan my veins would look bluish green. Anyway, I took her "Italian skin" remark as a compliment.
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Re: Ethnicity vs. skin tone

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Melanin in the iris affects eye color, but again my understanding is that olive skin is not melanin but an undertone.
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Re: Ethnicity vs. skin tone

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darkerhorse wrote: 14 Oct 2021, 01:41 Melanin in the iris affects eye color, but again my understanding is that olive skin is not melanin but an undertone.
My understanding is olive skin IS related to the melanin content. Both he and my mother had very dark brown eyes, as do I.

As for the calculator, I'm not certain on all the eye colors on my paternal side. I think my grandfather's were brown, but he died 13 years before I was born. I believe my grandmother had hazel eyes. The youngest brother had blue eyes, as did HIS maternal grandfather (Scots-Irish).

I have a friend who is half Sicilian and half northern Italian, with a trace of Welsh on the northern side. His skin is much lighter than mine (and he HAS had some skin cancer issues). His eyes are blue-gray.

I have also had many people comment on my skin tone. Quite a few have queried me as to Italian ancestry, which I affirmed. I also take it as a compliment...
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