Military information

[stfrancis]

I received these military documents for my relative Pasquale Balsamo (born in 1895 in NYC)

I was hoping someone might help translate them, at least the key points. Also does it refer to any other document which might be useful.

Thank you.

[stfrancis]

I have done most of the work, I am just stuck in a couple of areas as follows. Maybe someone can help fill in the gaps in these sections of the document, and also confirm the parts I think I did correctly:

bottom of 1st page -

Enlistment, service, promotions & other:

Soldier of the roll, 2nd category, class of 1896, district of Naples, omitted ???? from the class of 1895 and left on unlimited leave NOV 8, 1915
Called to the army and presented on NOV 29, 1915
Assigned to the base of the 12th Bersaglieri Regiment on DEC 8, 1915

Arrived in a region of declared warfare on DEC 8, 1915
Initiated ???? an approved convalescence .......???? on NOV 26, 1918
Reentered the base of the 12th Bersaglieri Regiment as Captain in such???? on MAY 26, 1919

top of 2nd page -

Captain Major ??? in said on May, 1919 ?????, 12th Regiment of Bersaglieri, Feb 1918 ?????

[AngelaGrace56]

Well done! Here's my two cents. I think that "base" and "depot" may have different functions in the military.

I have done most of the work, I am just stuck in a couple of areas as follows. Maybe someone can help fill in the gaps in these sections of the document, and also confirm the parts I think I did correctly:

bottom of 1st page -

Enlistment, service, promotions & other:

Drafted Soldier, 2nd category, class of 1896, district of Naples, omitted ???? from the class of 1895 and left on unlimited leave NOV 8, 1915
Called to the army and went on NOV 25, 1915
Assigned to the base (depot?) of the 12th Bersaglieri Regiment on DEC 8, 1915

Arrived in a region of declared warfare on DEC 8, 1915 (Went in territory declared state of war)
Ended (to go) on several months convalescence leave. NOV 26, 1918
Returned to the base (depot) of the 12th Bersaglieri Regiment MAY 26, 1919

as Captain in such???? on MAY 26, 1919 (Not exactly sure what Captain in said means?)

top of 2nd page -

Captain Major ??? in said on May, 1919 ?????, 12th Regiment of Bersaglieri, Feb 1918 ?????

Angela

[mmogno]

"Inviato" Ended (to go) on several months convalescence leave. NOV 26, 1918
Returned to the base (depot) of the 12th Bersaglieri Regiment MAY 26, 1919

as Caporale in such (depot) on MAY 26, 1919

top of 2nd page -

Caporale Major in said on May, 1919 ?????, 12th Regiment of Bersaglieri, Feb 1918 ?????

Angela

[stfrancis]

You have both helped me refine the key information, thank you.

I see on the page 2, in the 2nd or 3rd statement, a reference to...."pagamento..." ....
Made payment ..... per Circular N. 114 of G. M. 1919 in lire 1PO...from the district N. 1 of Naples... on DEC 21, 1919

Is this just administrative jargon....what is the pagamento for ? any ideas..

All of this leads me to ask...

If he was American born (citizen), in NY in 1895 , (returned to Italy in August 1912), he could still be drafted by the Italian army ? why would he have been missed on the 1895 roll?
Also, my understanding, if we assume an Italian citizen, his premilitary phase would have started by age 18, then full eligibility for the military by age 21 (Jan 1916), yet he would have been still only age 20 in Nov 1915 ?

[mmogno]

Effettuato il pagamento del premio di cui alla Circolare 114 del G(iornale) M(ilitare) 1919 in Lire 150 (*) dal Distretto Mil(itare di) Napoli 21 12 919

(*) "un premio di congedamento di Lire 100 per il primo anno e di Lire 50 per ogni anno successivo del servizio prestato"

[AngelaGrace56]

If he was American born (citizen), in NY in 1895 , (returned to Italy in August 1912), he could still be drafted by the Italian army ? why would he have been missed on the 1895 roll?

Also, my understanding, if we assume an Italian citizen, his premilitary phase would have started by age 18, then full eligibility for the military by age 21 (Jan 1916), yet he would have been still only age 20 in Nov 1915 ?

Possibly what may have happened was that a copy of his Birth Record was sent from New York back to Italia and didn't arrive until 1896, or maybe there was a clerical error.

Re your second question, Italy was at war. Nothing was normal anymore. (My ggf was eighteen when he fought for Italia in WWI. Sadly, there would've been younger men as well.)

Angela

[stfrancis]

Angela, you are so helpful, good points.

So under these war conditions, he was still "drafted" even though a US citizen. It would not be the case that he offered himself to join, and they used the Italian draft procedure to register him?

Also, Angela, I read back your translation, you mention "Ended (to go) on several months convalescence leave...". I am not sure I understand, Ended to go...isn't the Itlain word I read "Inviato...". Are you saying his convalescence ended on Nov 26, instead of it starting on that date?

Thanks

[AngelaGrace56]

Angela, you are so helpful, good points.

So under these war conditions, he was still "drafted" even though a US citizen. It would not be the case that he offered himself to join, and they used the Italian draft procedure to register him?

Sorry, I don't know about this. "A little knowledge is a dangerous thing!" For some reason I was understanding that his parents moved to the US, where Pasquale was born, and then the family returned to Italia. If the parents never naturalised then I "think" that Pasquale would've had Italian citizenship? (I'm not American so I don't exactly know what rules apply concerning citizenship etc there.) Maybe someone else who is more clued up with these matters could be more helpful and accurate. (I'm 99% sure that what must have happened was that the parents sent his birth record back to Italia after he was born – I'm understanding that he was entered as "n.332 in the 1896 Liste di Leva". If the 1895 and 1896 Birth Records for the town are online, you could take a look in the Supplementary Section (Part II) for his Birth Record.



Also, Angela, I read back your translation, you mention "Ended (to go) on several months convalescence leave...". I am not sure I understand, Ended to go...isn't the Itlain word I read "Inviato...". Are you saying his convalescence ended on Nov 26, instead of it starting on that date?

Yes, you are correct, it is "inviato". I misread the word. Sorry for the confusion. It should say "Sent on several months convalescence leave......"


Thanks

Hope this helps.

Also, incase you missed it, mmogno has answered your question re discharge payments.

Angela

Effettuato il pagamento del premio di cui alla Circolare 114 del G(iornale) M(ilitare) 1919 in Lire 150 (*) dal Distretto Mil(itare di) Napoli 21 12 919

(*) "un premio di congedamento di Lire 100 per il primo anno e di Lire 50 per ogni anno successivo del servizio prestato"

[stfrancis]

Thank you, Angela. I know, it's very confusing.

[stfrancis]

I found this article which I think talks about the repatriation of Italo-American citizens and even their US -born sons, who answered the call or were asked to join the Italian military in WW1....https://core.ac.uk/download/pdf/71054328.pdf

In my relative's case, since he he arrived in 1912, with his father (a US-naturlalised Italian), maybe he decided to stay and join, but I'm not sure, because I don't know about the Italian law at the time relative to Italo-Americans on their soil. Or Italy may have discovered he was there, and recruited him.

I would imagine he had to state an allegiance to Italy to join the army.

[mmogno]

"Inviato in licenza di convalescenza di mesi quattro" Sent in convalescence leave for 4 months. NOV 26, 1918
Angela

[stfrancis]

Thank you both. It makes sense with the dates, although I could not have deciphered that!

Looking back, I now read:

Chiamato alle armi e giunto....doesn't "armi" mean "arms" not "army" ....? so "called to arms..." ?

And, on top of the second page, I read something like:

Caporale Major...in said o. P. lt 190 of OCT 3, 1918 ? ....of the 12th Regiment Bersaglieri ?

[AngelaGrace56]

And, on top of the second page, I read something like:

Caporale Major...in said o. P. lt 190 of OCT 3, 1918 ? ....of the 12th Regiment Bersaglieri ?

Sorry, I'm totally useless at interpreting these military records This is what I am seeing:

"Cap(or)le m(aggio)re indetto?/in detto? o PH190 del 5 10 1918 (5 October 1918) del 12 Ber(saglie)re m()bo

I'm not sure whether it is indetto or in detto here. I guess in detto would be "in such" or "in said" referring to either PH190 or Bersaglieri. If it's the word indetto then I think that means "launched" as in "started". I don't know what PH190 is – some sort of written notification re promotion – or not? Hopefully someone else will know what this means.

"Inviato in licenza di convalescenza di mesi quattro" Sent on convalescence leave for 4 months. NOV 26, 1918
Angela

I think the word "on" is more correct here when translating to English?

Angela

[AngelaGrace56]

Thank you both. It makes sense with the dates, although I could not have deciphered that!

Well it does and it doesn't? He was actually away for five months, not four. Now that I take another look I can see that it probably does say four. I thought that it was another word that meant "several" so my bad, it would seem.

Looking back, I now read:

Chiamato alle armi e giunto....doesn't "armi" mean "arms" not "army" ....? so "called to arms..." ?

Yes, I would agree, with arms. Good on you.

Angela