Crippa family - Besnate area

[paola52]

Good luck!

[healey2000]

Hello Paola & Marty,

I wanted to let you know that I just received a reply from the first address that you gave to me in January.

Comune di Jerago con Orago - Demosocioculturale <demosocioculturale@comune.jeragoconorago.va.it>

It sounds as if they did "careful archival research" and located my Grandmother's sister (Ernesta) but not my Grandmother. The person replying sent Ernesta's Birth Information (appears to be a Birth Certificate) but could not locate any other information. This information certainly is a step in the right direction.

I learned that it is important to be patient when trying to access information from Italy. I also learned that Google Translate is very helpful when sending and interpreting messages. Thank you for all your assistance.
Marion

[paola52]

Hi Marion
I was away for a while so I missed your last post
I'm glad you found the info for Ernesta
However it is strange that they didn't find your Grandmother birth record. Did they give a reason for that? Missing records, records kept in another place? The comunes in this area have a very intricate story, as the villages were united and then separated more than once. Or maybe the family moved to another village after Ernesta's birth?
(By the way Google Translate can be really misleading when you use it to translate italian bureaucracy language!)
Did you contact the parish? If you can get her baptism record with the right dob you could write to the Comune with this info and ask that they have another look
Ciao
Paola

[healey2000]

Hi Paola,
Thank you for your reply. I, too, have been busy and away, thus just recently noticed your last message. No, there was no reason given for my Grandma's (Teresa) records to be missing from the office where her sister's (Ernesta) were found.

In the meantime, a relative gave me a copy of my Grandma's Birth Certificate "issued by the Vital Statistics Office of the City Hall of Gallarate. Toward the bottom of that document is the statement: "Rilasciato in cart libera per uso" (What does this phrase mean?) followed by the following information that is in a different type or font: "interno del Consolato d'Italia in Vancouver" and dated 17, Agosto, 1967 in Gallarate. it looks like this document may have been issued to my Grandma in 1967 via the Italian Consulates in Italy and Canada, either as proof of age perhaps for a Canadian pension or perhaps for another reason. On a second page is a statement from the Consolato D'Italia in Vancouver, BC, Canada, that confirms my Grandma's date of birth in Gallarate (former Crenna) based on the first document. and includes a Registration number that is from the Italian records. These two pages of information are a huge find.

Does this document mean anything special to you in light of no records found in the Jerago con Orago office? It looks like I gave my Grandma's correct date of birth to that office.

Thanks for the heads-up about using Google Translate for official records. I so wish I could speak Italian!

Thanks again to you and Marty for all your assistance. My next mission is to add information to the little that I already have about my Great Grandparents on both sides of my Grandma's family. I may be contacting you again.
Sincerely,
Marion

[paola52]

Hi Marion!
Yes, this document answers your questions.
Your Grandma was born in Crenna, an hamlet about 5 Km from Besnate. It appears that the family moved for a reason of other At the time Crenna was an indipendent Comune, but after 1923 it became part of the larger Comune of Gallarate. All the records of Crenna are now kept in the archive of Gallarate, and this is the reason why it was Gallarate that sent her birth certificate to the Consulate.
The reason why the certificate was released should be written after the words "rilasciato in carta libera per uso" . "Carta libera" means that it was issued without a duty stamp on it
Ciao
Paola

[healey2000]

Very interesting information, Paola. Yes, if my very minimal understanding of Italian is correct, it looks like the reason for issuing this document was for the internal use of the Italian Consolute ("interno del Consolato d"Italia in Vancouver").

Family stories have always said that my Grandma was born beside the Catholic church in Besnate. This information now appears to be incorrect. Would there be any way to find out where she was born in Crenna and/or where the family lived in Crenna?

I now know from earlier conversations with you and Marty that my Grandma Teresa's maternal Grandmother was Regina Puricelli. Do you know the name and any other information about Teresa's maternal Grandfather (possibly John Bassani) and where they lived?

Regarding my Grandma Teresa's paternal Grandparents, do you have any information on their names? Teresa's father's name was Giuseppe (could be spelled Guiseppe) Crippa (born 17 June 1869)? It is possible that Giuseppe's father's name was Carlo Crippa (born about 1852). I have no information on Giuseppe's mother.

Thank you once again for all your assistance.
Marion

[paola52]

Marion
The address of the family of a newborn was usually written on the original Atto di Nascita. So you can write to the Comune of Gallarate and ask for a "Copia integrale dell'Atto di Nascita" (basically a photo of the record) of your grandmother, using the info you gathered from the certificate.
When he went to the US in 1904 Giuseppe Crippa (Guiseppe is a misspelling) gave Crenna as last place of residence. Maybe he too was born in Crenna , so asking them for his Atto di nascita is surely worth a try
Address
anagrafe@comune.gallarate.va.it
If you are lucky you'll find the info about his father and his mother. From here you can go further back, but remember that before 1866 vital records in Lombardy were kept by the parishes
Ciao
Paola

[healey2000]

Thanks once again, Paola. It is helpful to know the correct spelling of my Great Grandfather's first name. Yes, I will follow up with the address that you provided for the comune (Gallarate). It does sound as if it will be a little more complicated when it comes time to contact a parish for documents prior to 1866 because I probably won't know which parish to contact.

Very Sincerely
Marion

[Lindsey]

Hello,

I came across an arrival record for Guiseppe and Assunta Crippa from Besnate today. It seems to match your family! The record is listed under Guiseppe Creppa in the New York, Passenger Lists, 1820-1957 - however upon looking at the handwritten record - it appears as Crippa. Here are the details:

Names: Guiseppe Creppa
Arrival: 21 July 1907
Birth date: abt 1869
Bith Location: Italy
BIrth Location other: it is written "careszate" although "Besnate" is clearly written for both Guiseppe and Asunta
Age: 38
Gender: Male
Ethnicity: Italian - North Italian
Point of departure: Havre
Port of Arrival: New York, NY
Ship name: La Savoie

Hopefully these are your relatives. I came across this while looking for Joseph Crappa (Creppa/Crippa?) who arrived in Butler County, PA from Italy with his wife Maria in the early 1900's. My father is as Joseph Crappa's grandson in a 1930 census record - although my father's parents (as we understand!) we both German. It is a mystery!

Good luck in your searching.

Best regards,
Lindsey

[healey2000]

Thank you Lindsey. Yes, that is my great grandfather. Actually, I had already found the Ellis Island information to which you refer. Different spellings certainly can create a challenge. My brick wall is mainly in Italy likely due to many records being stored in churches or community offices and not yet placed online.

All the best on your search. Just a thought: could it be that your Grandparents were born in Germany (or even in Switzerland) during a time of unrest in Italy? I'm asking because relatives on the other side of my family moved from Germany to Switzerland during a challenging time in Europe which resulted in siblings born in two different countries. The good news is that on the whole, German documents are easier to locate than Italian documents.
Cheers,
Marion

[paola52]

Hi Marion!
How is your research going?
Reading what Lindsay wrote I went again to the 1907 record. Giuseppe's place of birth -the one wrongly indexed as careszate- is very puzzling. But maybe -just maybe- it is Carugate, north of Milan.
And did you already try to locate his marriage act? Marriages usually took place in the bride's town of residence. So possibly in Besnate, around 1899.
Ciao
Paola