Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

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signoretti
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Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

Post by signoretti »

Hello ~

I just received this response letter from Rome regarding my request for my great grandmother Lena’s birth record. Could someone please help me understand what they are requesting I send to aquire the birth record.

Thank you so much for time & help given 😃
~ Emily
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D7FB13FB-30FB-45ED-9DD9-AC3963B29208.jpeg
71043ECD-DD13-4C20-8242-067C802A8E04.jpeg
Researching Surnames:
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PippoM
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Re: Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

Post by PippoM »

Hello!
Do you need it for genealogical research, or for administrative use (for instance, citizenship)?
Do you know when she was born?
Giuseppe "Pippo" Moccaldi

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signoretti
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Re: Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

Post by signoretti »

Hello and thanks for your response.
I need this certificate for geneological research. Lena was born on 30 July 1894.
Thanks again ~ :)
Researching Surnames:
Signoretti, Serroni, Moretti (Citta di Castello)
Ravetta, Clerici, Motta, Colli (Novara)
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Re: Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

Post by PippoM »

Might this be her (#1386)?

http://antenati.san.beniculturali.it/v/ ... 2.jpg.html

If not, you can search by yourself here:

http://antenati.san.beniculturali.it/v/ ... dice/1894/

or tell us her surname. :-)
Giuseppe "Pippo" Moccaldi

Certificate requests and genealogical researches in Italy.
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Re: Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

Post by signoretti »

YES, YES, YES!! This is her :D Thank you so much for finding this. Thank you, thank you!!! You are amazing!!

Could you please help me translate her certificate? I am not that good at translating the handwritten handwriting.

I am looking for names of relatives on the certificate or what part of Rome she was born and grew up in.

I know Lina's parents names where Ercole and Rita Ravetta. I have done extensive research on her parents. Her parents were born in Novara and emigrated to Rome sometime in the 1880's. Ercole came from a large family (14 kids including him) that were umbrella makers in Novara. When Ercole and Rita moved to Rome I beleive it was to open up the Umbrella and fine leather goods store.

Ercole and Rita had 2 sons (I know of their first born Frank Motta and I have alot of records for him because he came to the US and he was easily trackable) but the other son, the youngest I know nothing about, just heard of him through a family story.

Rita had 4 daughters Lina, Velia, Celeste and Elena and 2 sons Frank and unknown son.

My grandma had been told that the youngest daughter Elena died in Rome in her teenage years.I would like to find a death certificate for her and her father Ercole but have not a specific date or year to search.

My grandma was told from an aunt that Ercole died suddenly in Rome. Ercole's oldest son Frank was already in America, leaving the youngest son to run the store with his mom Rita and sisters. It is said that the younger son didn't help like he was supposed to, forcing my GGgrandma Rita and her daughters to close the store and then the mom and 3 daughters emigrated to the US in 1914, staying in America with Ritas first born son Frank Motta.

Frank Motta was born in 27 Maggio 1886 in Rome
Celeste Motta was born in 1887 in Rome
Velia Motta was born in 1892 in Rome
Lina Motta was born in 30 July 1894
Elena Motta was born in Rome
Unknown son was born in Rome

Maybe the unknown son was born between the years of 1888 and 1892 since there is a gap of a couple years without any children being born.

The only picture we have of the Motta sisters, Elena is the youngest in the picture. she had to have been born after Lina.

Was there any pictures taken in Italy before people left the country to emigrate?

I would love to see a picture of Lina or her family members. How could I find where the umbrella store was located?

It is all so intersting! I would love to find family still living in Rome or even in Novara.

Thank you so much again!!!!!! I am dancing around the house so happy!!!!!!!

Emily :D
Researching Surnames:
Signoretti, Serroni, Moretti (Citta di Castello)
Ravetta, Clerici, Motta, Colli (Novara)
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Re: Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

Post by liviomoreno »

Garibaldi Motta was born 1892 June 3, address Vicolo Spagnolo 12 p1.
Father: Ercole Motta 36yo, shopkeeper.
Mother: Rita Ravetta
stillborn
#1331
http://antenati.san.beniculturali.it/v/ ... ewsIndex=0

Elena Motta was born 1898 Aug 5, address Piazza Maddalena 2
Father: Ercole Motta 41yo, umbrella seller.
Mother: Rita Ravetta
#2727
http://antenati.san.beniculturali.it/v/ ... ewsIndex=0
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Re: Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

Post by Tessa78 »

Following Pippo and Livio's leads... :-)
My grandma had been told that the youngest daughter Elena died in Rome in her teenage years. I would like to find a death certificate for her and her father Ercole but have not a specific date or year to search.

Here is the death act of Ercole Motta in 1903 in Rome. (#786)

Ercole was age 47, a shopkeeper residing in Rome, born in Novara to deceased Bartolomeo and to [living] Maddalena Cella. He was the husband of Rita Ravetta.
He died in the house in P(iazza) Maddlena #2, on 13 February 1903 at 9:30 PM.
http://antenati.san.beniculturali.it/v/ ... ewsIndex=0


...and the death act of Elena Motta in 1914 (#2780)

Elena was age 15, born and residing in Rome. She was the daughter of deceased Ercole and of Rita Ravetta. Elena was unmarried.
She died at 6:20 PM on 8 June 1914 at the hospital.
http://antenati.san.beniculturali.it/v/ ... ewsIndex=0

***
Here is the birth act for Ferruccio Gaudenzio Bartolomeo Motta (who you called FRANK)
#544 - dated 30 May 1886 - birth on 27 May, at the house in Via dell'Orso #15
Father: Ercole, 30, shopkeeper
Mother: Rita Ravetta, his wife
http://antenati.san.beniculturali.it/v/ ... 3.jpg.html

NOTE:
In addition to Ferruccio/Frank, AND the stillborn son whose birth act was posted above by Livio :-) - there appears to have been TWO more sons, Armaldo (born 1887) and Luciano (born 1889). I have posted Luciano's birth act below...

Son - Luciano
#1558 - dated 25 July 1889 - born on 21 July at 7:30 PM
Father: Ercole, 33, umbrella maker
Mother: Rita Ravetta, his wife.
Child was given the name Luciano Cesare Battista
http://antenati.san.beniculturali.it/v/ ... ewsIndex=0

T.
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Re: Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

Post by signoretti »

Liviomoreno & Tessa this is amazing!!!!!! I am seriously dancing around the house in pure joy & excitment!!!!!!!!!!

Thank you, thank you, thank you!!!

I am so happy to see these records and to have the addresses they were born/living and died at is unbeliavable!!!! I never knew any of these dates or anything!!!!

I am overjoyed!!!!

Looking at Linas birth record could you please translate the address she was born at?

How could I possably find out more imformation about the umbrella shop Ercoles family worked at? On Ercoles birthrecord from Novara it lists his father as an umbrella maker. On Linas birth vertifivate I noticed it said Carlo Motta umbrella maker as the witness, which was Ercoles older brother. I'm so curious?

Thanks again for all your continiued help, you all are so amazing!!!!!!!!!! :D :D :D :D :D :D
Researching Surnames:
Signoretti, Serroni, Moretti (Citta di Castello)
Ravetta, Clerici, Motta, Colli (Novara)
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Re: Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

Post by signoretti »

OMG Tessa!!!!

2 more sons!!!!!!! YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Yahoo!!!!!!!!!!!!

Going to look at those records now, yay!!!!

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
Researching Surnames:
Signoretti, Serroni, Moretti (Citta di Castello)
Ravetta, Clerici, Motta, Colli (Novara)
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Re: Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

Post by signoretti »

:D :D :D Wow what a morning, from knowing nothing to all of this!!! SO AMAZING!

Could you possably attach the birth records for the other two sisters Celeste born in 1888, Velia born in 1893 and the brother Armaldo born in 1887. I tried to find them but I was completly lost.

Could you also translate the address where Lina was born. I would love to visit that place when I go to Italy with my family.

How could I search buisnesses in Rome that existed so long ago. It seems as if the Motta Umberlla shop was a family shop. I would love to know more, I'm on a mission :)

Grazie mille!!!!!!!!!
Researching Surnames:
Signoretti, Serroni, Moretti (Citta di Castello)
Ravetta, Clerici, Motta, Colli (Novara)
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Re: Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

Post by signoretti »

Here is the only picture we have of my Ravetta/Motta great grandmother Rita and grandma Lina and her aunts.
From left to right is:
Velia, Celeste, Rita ravetta, Lina and Elena
:)
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Researching Surnames:
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Re: Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

Post by Tessa78 »

Sometimes we get lucky finding records! :-)

The address in Lina's birth act is Via Pantheone (looks like #45)

Here is the birth act for son, Arnaldo Celestino Motta, in 1888

#1593 - dated 8 August 1888 in Rome -
Father: Ercole Motta, 32, shopkeeper
Mother: Rita Ravetta, his wife
Birth on the 6th of August at the house in Vico Spagnoli #24
http://antenati.san.beniculturali.it/v/ ... ewsIndex=0

NOTE: I located THREE sisters in the birth index: Maria (1884), Celeste (1887), and Velia (1891). It looks like they had 5 daughters in total.
I will look for their birth acts.

Here is the birth act for Velia Adelina Carlotta Motta in 1891.
#1135 - dated 7 May 1891
Father: Ercole Motta, 34, umbrella makers
Mother: Rita Rabetta (that is the spelling in the record), his wife
Birth on 5 May in the house at Vicolo Spagnoli #24.
http://antenati.san.beniculturali.it/v/ ... ewsIndex=0

The other two sisters are listed in the index as:
Maria (daughter of Ercole) Motta - year 1884 - Act #1864 - Series "C"
Celeste (daughter of ERcole) Motta - year 1887 - Act #1006 - Series "B"
I have not been able to locate the records...

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Re: Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

Post by signoretti »

Wow Tessa this is so amazing!!!!!!!!! I cannot thank you enough!!!!!! GRAZIE MILLE!!!

Today has been so amazing!!! I've google earth all the address and seen where my great grandma and her brothers and sisters were born and grew up.

I've been calling my 91 year old grandma all day telling her the wonderful findings. My grandmas mom was Lina.

No one ever knew of the first born Maria, everyone always thought Ferruccio Frank was the first born. I wonder if Maria died young?

Lina died when my grandma was 12 years old so we do not know much about the Mottas, so these findings today have been so refreshing!!!

This is all so interesting! Reading about the umbrella makers of Italy is so intruiging. They were a special group of artists.

I wonder if I still have Motta family living in Rome?
Researching Surnames:
Signoretti, Serroni, Moretti (Citta di Castello)
Ravetta, Clerici, Motta, Colli (Novara)
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Re: Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

Post by Tessa78 »

signoretti wrote: 21 Dec 2017, 23:05 Wow Tessa this is so amazing!!!!!!!!! I cannot thank you enough!!!!!! GRAZIE MILLE!!!

Today has been so amazing!!! I've google earth all the address and seen where my great grandma and her brothers and sisters were born and grew up.

I've been calling my 91 year old grandma all day telling her the wonderful findings. My grandmas mom was Lina.

No one ever knew of the first born Maria, everyone always thought Ferruccio Frank was the first born. I wonder if Maria died young?

Lina died when my grandma was 12 years old so we do not know much about the Mottas, so these findings today have been so refreshing!!!

This is all so interesting! Reading about the umbrella makers of Italy is so intruiging. They were a special group of artists.

I wonder if I still have Motta family living in Rome?

Yes, she did...
Maria Motta died in 1884 at the age of 15 days.
#1264 - Dated 12 December 1884 in Rome
Father: Ercole Motta, 29, shopkeeper
Mother: Rita Ravetta, his wife
Maria died on 11 December at 8:45 PM at the house in Via dell'Orso #15
http://antenati.san.beniculturali.it/v/ ... ewsIndex=0

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Re: Letter from Rome ~ please help translate

Post by signoretti »

Tessa this is AMAZING!!!!!! :) :)

Thank you so much :) I have come accross many similarities in birthdays back then to my family living now :)

I have googled all the addresses and seen where my ancestors were born. It is so wonderful to think my great grandma Lina was born, lived and grew up yards from The Pantheon. The house Elena was born in and Ercole died in is now a hotel. My family & I have gotta stay there when we go :)

I just can't wait to go there someday and walk those streets :) :)

I can't thank you all enough, grazie mille Tessa, Liveo, PippoM!!!!!!!!! This forum is the most amazing place! I have used it for 9 years and have made many, many connections and discoveries only because of your kind help, thank you a million times!!!

I was trying to read some of the witnesses names and occupations on the birth records for some more clues on familys names that resided in Rome. They are so hard to read. The only one I could make out was on Linas birth record saying Carlo Motta, Ercoles brother also an Umbrella maker.

~ Emily :)
Researching Surnames:
Signoretti, Serroni, Moretti (Citta di Castello)
Ravetta, Clerici, Motta, Colli (Novara)
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