Hi all!
I'm hoping to start a thread that addresses the various lawyers in Italy who deal with cases involving citizenship through women born before 1948. I couldn't find a thread like that on here, aside from the larger thread on Luigi, but if I missed it, just let me know.
I myself am going through my mother, who was born in 1946, and have been working with Luigi Paiano for a few years (our case is a little complicated). Because Luigi does get a lot of attention on here, I thought it might be useful to hear from those of us who are working with, and/or have had success with, other lawyers.
Personally, I'm also realizing that, at this stage, because my case is less straight forward I may be interested in bringing it to another lawyer. I think Luigi is great, but lately I've just been interested in exploring my options a bit. So, if you have a case that turned out to be more complicated and you had an Italian lawyer who handled it particularly well, I'd love to know about that!
1948 rule & lawyers who handle the cases
Re: 1948 rule & lawyers who handle the cases
Hi cvmadd, I'm also at my early stages of working with Luigi. I didn't even consider working with other lawyers, since Luigi seems to be the expert in this field.
Could you tell me why your case is a bit special? Seems like if it's through your mom it shouldn't be a problem?
Thanks so much and best of luck.
Could you tell me why your case is a bit special? Seems like if it's through your mom it shouldn't be a problem?
Thanks so much and best of luck.
Re: 1948 rule & lawyers who handle the cases
Actually, I have been worndering about the lawyer thing too...I'm working with Marco Mantovani...I don't know if anyone has any references about him. He responds right away and he is very nice but we still have not found great grandfather's birth certificate and we have all the necessary information. I don't know if it's Marco or just the bureaucracy in Palermo in general that takes for ever...
The issue with Luigi for us is that he also charges per person and there is quite a few of us involved so we have to consider everyone's needs...
Good luck with your case!
The issue with Luigi for us is that he also charges per person and there is quite a few of us involved so we have to consider everyone's needs...
Good luck with your case!
Re: 1948 rule & lawyers who handle the cases
Hello to both!
@camilamv Luigi is great, so if he's working well for you, that's perfect! But as I've learned, and confirmed with other folks, if you have a less straightforward case, he tends to not want to take those on. And he did kind of back away from ours saying that, though it wasn't impossible, it would be complicated. Essentially, mine involves a document coming to light about 2 years into working with Luigi wherein my grandmother was listed as a minor (17 y/o) on one part of my great grandfather's naturalization papers. According to the year we thought she was born, it seems like she would've actually been 18, but that aside...due to the laws at the time (the 1920s), she needed to also have filed her own papers when she turned 18, which she never did...hence why we got a letter of 'no record' etc. from USCIS initially. So, one way to challenge this would be to use the letter I have from USCIS saying there are no records in own her name, and arguing that she didn't give up her citizenship voluntarily. Another way to challenge it is the fact that her mother never naturalized. Not even with her father, though we don't know why (he doesn't list her on his papers, and there are no records for her). So, we could argue that she retained her Italian citizenship in a 'pre-1948 case' way via her mother. But even if we rule all of that out, and we accept that she was a US citizen after her father naturalized (which, for all intents an purposes, she was/would've been), she then also went on to marry an Italian citizen, my grandfather, thus becoming an Italian citizen once again. My grandfather naturalized a little before my mother was born (which is why we're not going through him), but my grandmother never did anything about her own citizenship after that, which at that stage in the late 1930's she should've. I know, my grandmother's citizenship could give you whiplash it goes back and forth so often!! But either way, we have some solid possibilities that have also worked for others, but I think Luigi deals with so many cases, that it's hard for him to really dig into more complicated ones. That's how it seems to me anyway. And I have heard on other message boards about other lawyers who have taken on cases like mine and won, so I guess I'm just hoping to find one of those!
@mgpuppo I hear you on the costs. It definitely adds up if you're trying to get whole families onboard! Also, for what it's worth, I have heard that Palermo is notoriously slow for records, so you may want to just ignore what I'm about to say and wait it out...but I want to suggest to you someone I'm currently working with to get an official copy of my nonna's birth record: Francesco Curione. I don't know whether this is useful to you since you already have a lawyer working on it, but I've been really pleased with Francesco, and so have a number of other people who recommended him to me. He is very fast, has good pricing, and is actually also located in Palermo, though he works with comunes all over Italy. You can find him on facebook at 007 Italian Records. Anyway, just something to consider!
Very, very best of luck to you both!!!
@camilamv Luigi is great, so if he's working well for you, that's perfect! But as I've learned, and confirmed with other folks, if you have a less straightforward case, he tends to not want to take those on. And he did kind of back away from ours saying that, though it wasn't impossible, it would be complicated. Essentially, mine involves a document coming to light about 2 years into working with Luigi wherein my grandmother was listed as a minor (17 y/o) on one part of my great grandfather's naturalization papers. According to the year we thought she was born, it seems like she would've actually been 18, but that aside...due to the laws at the time (the 1920s), she needed to also have filed her own papers when she turned 18, which she never did...hence why we got a letter of 'no record' etc. from USCIS initially. So, one way to challenge this would be to use the letter I have from USCIS saying there are no records in own her name, and arguing that she didn't give up her citizenship voluntarily. Another way to challenge it is the fact that her mother never naturalized. Not even with her father, though we don't know why (he doesn't list her on his papers, and there are no records for her). So, we could argue that she retained her Italian citizenship in a 'pre-1948 case' way via her mother. But even if we rule all of that out, and we accept that she was a US citizen after her father naturalized (which, for all intents an purposes, she was/would've been), she then also went on to marry an Italian citizen, my grandfather, thus becoming an Italian citizen once again. My grandfather naturalized a little before my mother was born (which is why we're not going through him), but my grandmother never did anything about her own citizenship after that, which at that stage in the late 1930's she should've. I know, my grandmother's citizenship could give you whiplash it goes back and forth so often!! But either way, we have some solid possibilities that have also worked for others, but I think Luigi deals with so many cases, that it's hard for him to really dig into more complicated ones. That's how it seems to me anyway. And I have heard on other message boards about other lawyers who have taken on cases like mine and won, so I guess I'm just hoping to find one of those!
@mgpuppo I hear you on the costs. It definitely adds up if you're trying to get whole families onboard! Also, for what it's worth, I have heard that Palermo is notoriously slow for records, so you may want to just ignore what I'm about to say and wait it out...but I want to suggest to you someone I'm currently working with to get an official copy of my nonna's birth record: Francesco Curione. I don't know whether this is useful to you since you already have a lawyer working on it, but I've been really pleased with Francesco, and so have a number of other people who recommended him to me. He is very fast, has good pricing, and is actually also located in Palermo, though he works with comunes all over Italy. You can find him on facebook at 007 Italian Records. Anyway, just something to consider!
Very, very best of luck to you both!!!
Re: 1948 rule & lawyers who handle the cases
Yes, I’ve also seen similar stories on other sites. Luigi tends to shy away from less straightforward cases even those that other lawyers are willing to take them on. He was, of course, a pioneer in 1948 cases and has so much work, he really can do this on autopilot and avoid more complex litigation.
Re: 1948 rule & lawyers who handle the cases
I wanted to ask how your experience with Marco is working out for you? I am looking at using him as well but I think it is good to research a bit to insure good service.mgpuppo wrote: 13 Jan 2019, 00:15 Actually, I have been worndering about the lawyer thing too...I'm working with Marco Mantovani...I don't know if anyone has any references about him. He responds right away and he is very nice but we still have not found great grandfather's birth certificate and we have all the necessary information. I don't know if it's Marco or just the bureaucracy in Palermo in general that takes for ever...
The issue with Luigi for us is that he also charges per person and there is quite a few of us involved so we have to consider everyone's needs...
Good luck with your case!
Thank you
Re: 1948 rule & lawyers who handle the cases
I have has contact with Paola CAPUTI, who seems ok. I contacted Luigi with a very straightforward 1948 case. Grandmother born in Italy, father born in Italy in 1947.
He kept saying 'move to Italy for 3 years.
Very strange, i get the feeling he does not want to take on more cases.
He kept saying 'move to Italy for 3 years.
Very strange, i get the feeling he does not want to take on more cases.
Re: 1948 rule & lawyers who handle the cases
I'm using ICA, though it took a while to retain them since they are backlogged with client requests, so far so good on the process. Initially thought I would use my GGF but he claimed NA on his census documents before my GF was born, so I had to switch to my GGM for a 1948 case which further justified ICA as a Lawyer.
