1816 Marriage

[NickAndreola]

http://dl.antenati.san.beniculturali.it ... ewsIndex=0

I've got the general drift here for the marriage of Michele Lauria, 28 [son of Melchiorre (52) & Angela Saveria Pasquale (50)] and Maria Contiacovo, 16 [dau of fu Domenico & Anna Vittoria David (60)].

What I can't quite make out is the middle part that says something about Michele being a soldier sent to or registered in Potenza on Sep 2, 1816...?

I'm getting a pretty garbled translation and would appreciate any insights that might add more to this couple's story.

Also, is there any way to access whatever that military? record #3547 might be?

Thanks!

[erudita74]

Nick
I'm going out on a limb with this one, and one of the native Italian speakers on this forum will have to correct me, I'm sure, but I'm wondering if it means that, as a soldier, he was granted some personal time, so that he could marry her before her father died and that, after the marriage, he then went on to fulfill the rest of his required military service.
Erudita

[PippoM]

Erudita, you have understood better than me what he meant, congratulations!
The one thing I can't see is the reason...I don't read that they let him marry before the bride's father died...where is it?

[erudita74]

Erudita, you have understood better than me what he meant, congratulations!
The one thing I can't see is the reason...I don't read that they let him marry before the bride's father died...where is it?

Hi Pippo
I think the issue is whether or not I translated correctly the phrase "figlia minore di Domenico premorto." I took this to mean that the minor bride's father, Domenico, wasn't already deceased, but was dying (pre death), and that this was the reason why the couple couldn't wait until the groom had completed his military service to get married.

But, I do know that the dictionary translates the word "premorto" as "deceased," so maybe I am wrong.

Erudita

[AngelaGrace56]

Ciao Erudita and Pippo

When I saw this written earlier, I was understanding that the father had already passed, and not that he was dying. I've seen premorto (deceased) before in either Potenza or Matera towns, or maybe both. I also saw the word "fede" there and was thinking that meant that the father's Death Certificate had been presented as an attachment, but couldn't quite catch the other words there.

I then located the Publication for this marriage, dated 15 September 1816, but didn't have time to post it so will post it here now. It might help to shine some light.

In the publication, the wording is different and indicates that the father has died already. I'm also seeing the word "fede" in both the Marriage Record and Publication which I'm understanding to be the father's death certificate that was presented? (I can't completely catch all the other words there though at the moment so I might be wrong.)

Another thing I'm noticing is that the wording about Michele Lauria being a "disbanded? soldier who was granted leave etc" is a little clearer in the pubblication, but I'm not completely understanding the word "sbandato" in the context of this particular record. I know I've seen the word before in military records. If he was just on leave, which is what the record seems to be saying, then my thinking is that "possibly" the bride may have been pregnant. It would be interesting to see when their first child was born.

Or, might the word "sbandato" mean something completely different in this particular record?

Pubblication:
http://dl.antenati.san.beniculturali.it ... 1.jpg.html

Angela

[NickAndreola]

Thanks for the help y'all. Yes, some of those words like 'sbandato' were throwing the google translator into some weird directions.

Angela, I think you've hit one part of it dead on....their first child Angiola/Angela Saveria was born ~6 months after the marriage on March 24, 1817. Michele was home to report the birth so......it would seem he was discharged from service because of the pregnancy or at least that he'd finished his duty by that date and was back at his shoemaker profession.

http://dl.antenati.san.beniculturali.it ... ewsIndex=0

Is there a source to get at those military records?

[mmogno]

1) "figlia minore di Domenico premorto" secondo me vuol dire semplicemente che Domenico era già deceduto al momento del matrimonio della figlia.

2) "come da fede" significa solo "come risulta dal certificato", forse rilasciato da un parroco.

3) Alla fine del 1816, dopo la caduta di Napoleone e la sconfitta di Gioacchino Murat, avviene l'unificazione del Regno di Napoli con quello di Sicilia in quello che prende il nome di Regno delle Due Sicilie. In quell'occasione vengono amalgamati i due eserciti preesistenti, anzi quello borbonico con i resti di quello murattiano, sconfitto, sfaldato e sbandato dopo la sconfitta di Tolentino.
Mi pare di capire che Michele Lauria facesse parte di quest'ultimo, si fosse sbandato come molti altri e, nel contesto della riorganizzazione successiva, fosse stato congedato con l'atto n.3547 di Potenza.
https://issuu.com/rivista.militare1/doc ... 1815-al-18

[cedrone]

I agree with what said by Angela and mmogno.
The meaning of 'premorto' is 'deceased before', 'already deceased' ; 'fede' refers to the father's certificate of death, that was put in the 'allegati' ('volume delle carte' [?]);
(the terms used  here are a bit different from those I saw on the registers of Lombardia). So only the mother gave consent to the marriage of Maria, that was a minor.

I don't  understand why there is also the approval of Michele's parents as he was 28 yo.
The term 'sbandato' usually refers to soldiers left without orders and which left their place. I suppose it refers to the political changes of the year 1815 in that area   (Trattato di Casalanza signed 20 May 1815); probably
he was a soldier of the preceding army, reintegrated in the army of the (new) Regno delle Due Sicilie.  Not  evident why this info is put in a marriage act.

[mmogno]

@cedrone
Lo sposo non era integrato nel nuovo esercito e doveva esibire il foglio di congedo per dimostrare di non avere più obblighi militari.

[cedrone]

OK.

[NickAndreola]

Cedrone,

I don't understand why there is also the approval of Michele's parents as he was 28 yo.

This appears to be standard operating procedure for this town. The 2 publications (#12 & #13) immediately preceding (#14) Michele Lauria's are both for 22 year old men with their parent's consent noted.


Thanks for that insight, mmogno!
"The bridegroom was not integrated into the new army and had to show the discharge sheet to prove that he no longer had military obligations."