Vincenzo = James??

[bnelson]

Can anyone tell me if it is common for a man named Vincenzo in Italy to be called James after immigrating to America? I have two different relatives in different families where I think this occurred, but in both cases I am not completely sure if Vincenzo and James are the same person.

I always thought that Vincenzo = Vincent and James = Giacomo. Is that wrong?

Bill

[johnnyonthespot]

It is very common indeed. The best explanation I have seen is that the usual nickname for Vincenzo is "cenz" which when pronounced by an Italian sounds somewhat like James.

By the way, Giacomo often = Jack.

[Rodio]

Thanks Carmine for your explanation. Like the OP, I have 2 ancestors who went from Vincenzo to James, and I have always wondered why they did not go by Vincent.

[johnnyonthespot]

You can listen to a good approximation of "cenz" here http://www.oddcast.com/home/demos/tts/t ... hp?sitepal

Try several of the available voices. The "e" is pronounced as an English "long A" and the overall word comes out sounding something like "chains" or "chains-sa". Using the Matteo and Roberto voices, it is easy to see how cenz might become James.

While you are there, try Giacomo and the shortened Giaco as well.

PS: One of my US-born uncles was named Vincenzo at birth but always known as "Jimmy".

[bnelson]

Thank you, your response is very helpful. Another mystery solved.

Bill

[carinthiangirl]

"I always thought that Vincenzo = Vincent and James = Giacomo. Is that wrong?"
is correct - two different names:

JAMES
GENDER: Masculine
USAGE: English, Biblical
PRONOUNCED: JAYMZ (English)
VARIANT: Jaymes (English)
DIMINUTIVES: Jim, Jem, Jay, Jamey (English)
OTHER LANGUAGES: Yakub, Yaqub (Arabic), Hagop, Hakob (Armenian), Jakes (Basque), Iakobos (Biblical Greek), Yaakov (Biblical Hebrew), Iacobus (Biblical Latin), Yakov (Bulgarian), Jaume (Catalan), Jago (Cornish), Jakov, Jakob (Croatian), Jakub (Czech), Jakob, Jacobus, Jacob (Dutch), Jakob, Jaakob, Jaagup (Estonian), Jaakoppi (Finnish), Jacques (French), Iago (Galician), Jakob (German), Iakopa, Kimo (Hawaiian), Yakov, Yaakov, Akiba, Akiva (Hebrew), Jákob, Jakab (Hungarian), Sheamus, Shamus, Séamus, Séamas (Irish), Jacopo, Giacobbe, Giacomo, Iacopo (Italian), Jacobus, Iacomus (Late Roman), Jokūbas (Lithuanian), Jakov (Macedonian), Hemi (Maori), Jakub (Polish), Jaime, Iago, Jacó (Portuguese), Yakov (Russian), Jakob, Jacob (Scandinavian), Seumas (Scottish), Jakub (Slovak), Jakob, Jaša (Slovene), Yago, Jacobo, Jaime (Spanish), Yakup (Turkish), Yakiv (Ukrainian), Iago (Welsh)

VINCENT
GENDER: Masculine
USAGE: English, French, Dutch, Danish, Swedish, Slovak
PRONOUNCED: VIN-sənt (English), ven-SAWN (French)
DIMINUTIVES: Vinny, Vinnie, Vince, Vin (English)
OTHER LANGUAGES: Bikendi (Basque), Vicent, Vicenç (Catalan), Vincenc (Czech), Vinzenz, Vinzent (German), Vince, Bence (Hungarian), Uinseann (Irish), Vincenzo, Vincente (Italian), Vincentius (Late Roman), Vincentas (Lithuanian), Wincenty (Polish), Vicente (Portuguese), Vikenti (Russian), Vikentije (Serbian), Vincenc (Slovene), Vicente (Spanish)

[johnnyonthespot]

Yes, they are very different names.

But Italian immigrants named Vincenzo who came to the US (or were born in the US) commonly use the name James or Jimmy in their daily life. No one knows why, other than the possible similar sound of "cenz" and "James".

[carinthiangirl]

such things often happen - don´t also know why.

[james71]

I always thought that Vincenzo = Vincent and James = Giacomo. Is that wrong?"
is correct - two different names:

JAMES
GENDER: Masculine
USAGE: English, Biblical
PRONOUNCED: JAYMZ (English)
VARIANT: Jaymes (English)
DIMINUTIVES: Jim, Jem, Jay, Jamey (English)
OTHER LANGUAGES: Yakub, Yaqub (Arabic), Hagop, Hakob (Armenian), Jakes (Basque), Iakobos (Biblical Greek), Yaakov (Biblical Hebrew), Iacobus (Biblical Latin), Yakov (Bulgarian), Jaume (Catalan), Jago (Cornish), Jakov, Jakob (Croatian), Jakub (Czech), Jakob, Jacobus, Jacob (Dutch), Jakob, Jaakob, Jaagup (Estonian), Jaakoppi (Finnish), Jacques (French), Iago (Galician), Jakob (German), Iakopa, Kimo (Hawaiian), Yakov, Yaakov, Akiba, Akiva (Hebrew), Jákob, Jakab (Hungarian), Sheamus, Shamus, Séamus, Séamas (Irish), Jacopo, Giacobbe, Giacomo, Iacopo (Italian), Jacobus, Iacomus (Late Roman), Jokūbas (Lithuanian), Jakov (Macedonian), Hemi (Maori), Jakub (Polish), Jaime, Iago, Jacó (Portuguese), Yakov (Russian), Jakob, Jacob (Scandinavian), Seumas (Scottish), Jakub (Slovak), Jakob, Jaša (Slovene), Yago, Jacobo, Jaime (Spanish), Yakup (Turkish), Yakiv (Ukrainian), Iago (Welsh)



Thanks for sharing this post.

[james71]

Yes, they are very different names.

But Italian immigrants named Vincenzo who came to the US (or were born in the US) commonly use the name James or Jimmy in their daily life. No one knows why, other than the possible similar sound of "cenz" and "James".
Carmine

My hobby is finding things. Having found most of my own, I am happy to help others find theirs. PM me

[Heavin7904]

This is simpler than people think. The first part of the answer is to know your Italian history and the differences between the valleys and other parts.

The main colprit, and only that I know of, is Sicilians. No other Italian born men that I know, myself included (my Grandfather migrated from italy), use the name unless they have Sicilian heritage.

Sicily was Extremely different in culture than the rest of Italy. The answer was Sicilians developed this nickname for migrating to the United States. Someone mentioned the sound of the name and that was correct. The last thing they would want is to have a name that OBVIOUSLY instantly identifies as Italian.

"Jimmy" was born. So to add a last point. This will seem like it is "made up" if you ask certain Italians, because it is politically incorrect to say "Italians" did this because... When it is ONLY ONE kind of Italians that partook in this nicknaming. Pretty much only Sicilian American households will be heard doing this.

My family's origin is Northern Italy, and We actually have numerous "Vincenzo" and "Vinnie" as well as two other relatives named "James". So as you can see they are COMPLETELY different to my Italian family's understanding.

[vincauterojr]

@Heavin7904

This explanation may only be partially correct. Yes, "James/Jimmy" was born out of Italian immigrants' desire to "Americanize" as quickly as possible, but this phenomenon is not limited to only Italians with a Sicilian heritage. There were Italians from many regions outside of Sicily that also adopted the "James/Jimmy" nickname in place of Vincent/Vincenzo back in the late 1800s and early 1900s. In fact, several of my own relatives born in Campania made the switch to "James/Jimmy" for themselves or one of their sons once they came to the U.S. I also know of families from Puglia and Calabria who also adopted the name change once they immigrated to the U.S.

I believe the explanation given here by @johnnyonthespot (Carmine) is the correct answer, given conversations I have had with my ancestors.