Dark-skinned Italians near Rome

[MarcuccioV]

BTW, the large gentleman (with the child & spouse) is a 66% facial match with my grandfather (using a different straight-on photo I have) -- certainly close enough to be a cousin...

The lady who is confirmed to be his cousin is a 49% match.

His cousin to these 2 people are in the mid-60 %, and he is 66% to the female.

Your guess is as good as mine...

[darkerhorse]

Rome has been a cosmopolitan city for ages so it's no surprises to find a wide variety of people living there.

[darkerhorse]

The man in the second photo doesn't look Caucasian, or at least not fully.

[darkerhorse]

Have you searched records for persons from your town (including non-relatives) to see if there are enclaves of particular races, ethnicities, religions, etc. which might explain darker skin pigment?

Very few pics of unrelated people from that area (at least from the time period), & those I've seen don't seem very dark. No clues by surname.

No records online before 1871. I would have to write to Italy for info, & my understanding is that is a crapshoot at best...

Have you tried the equivalent of Riveli records on the mainland? They can go back to the 16th century.

[MarcuccioV]

Have you tried the equivalent of Riveli records on the mainland? They can go back to the 16th century.

There aren't any. The problem is Valmontone was previously in the province of Frosinone (now in province of Rome). Frosinone records were mostly lost during the WWII carpet bombings of the region.

Some records are trickling out, but they are few & far between. Even the more recent acts from Cassino had to be recreated from scratch using family member's recollections.

There's a very good chance those records may be permanently lost...

There ARE records (parish records, etc) that go back further, however you have to have a local genealogist do the search for you (for BIG $$$). Not currently in my budget. And no guarantee anything useful will be found...

[darkerhorse]

What's the ancestry mix of the DNA match?

[MarcuccioV]

What's the ancestry mix of the DNA match?

Eng/NW Eur -- 49%
North Italy -- 36%
Greece/Alb -- 7%
South Italy -- 6%
Scotland 2%

Mind you, this is Ancestry, who has the least accurate matrix (at least for me). His seems pretty on the money (except for the north/south Italy mix) though compared with mine...
Mark

[darkerhorse]

No suggestion of race variation in that mix. Is the DNA match certain he has blood relation to the man in the photos?

[MarcuccioV]

No suggestion of race variation in that mix. Is the DNA match certain he has blood relation to the man in the photos?

He only knows he is a family member to his mother's side -- he does not know the relationship. The only person he was certain about turned out to be my grandfather's maternal first cousin...

[darkerhorse]

So the dark-skinned man could be related to the DNA match through marriage or friendship, and not be related to you at all. Sounds like a wild goose chase.

[MarcuccioV]

So the dark-skinned man could be related to the DNA match through marriage or friendship, and not be related to you at all. Sounds like a wild goose chase.

Possible, but doubtful. He is certain they are parenti, as the pics came from his mother. He said they were family from the Valmontone/Artena area, just not sure of the exact relationships. There were other photos, but they were lighter-skinned like the ladies in the 2nd pic. We are friends on Facebook, and looking at photos of him, he has what I'd call a medium olive complexion, not the typical English pink or ruddy tone despite his 50% UK ancestry.

The photo's only struck me only since their carnagione is almost identical to my grandfather's, who was 1st cousin to his GGm.

And even if unrelated, their coloring is still intriguing based on the location...

[darkerhorse]

Using picture "corrections" you can see features better. Is there a problem with his left eye? Is his front tooth missing?

What do you make of his hair and features?

[darkerhorse]

Here.

[darkerhorse]

If so, it might give clues to his identity.

[darkerhorse]

He doesn't look Roman to me.