Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of Chi

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Essgee
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Re: Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of

Post by Essgee »

Gina501 wrote:Ok, so now that we found a possible date of birth, how do I go about writing to Pavia and Piacenza for birth records. I do not speak Italian and I am assuming the letter must be in Italian. Do I have to send money? Does anyone know how I go about this?


You can write to the comune and ask about his birth record. But you can also rent--at the Family History Library--the birth records for the town for the year in question. Have you ever used the Family History Library? Located usually near a Mormon church, you can check out the libraries at www.familysearch.org Click on the right column and see what library branch might be near your home.

The rental of films is around $5.50. The films remain in the branch for a month and you can renew them. These are the civil records of the town...birth, death, marriage records. They are in Italian, but can be read with a translation dictionary. They will take about 3 weeks to get to your branch from the main depository in Utah. It is the best way to get a lot of info about an individual and his family. In your case, this may not work because of the fact he was adopted. But his birth record should be there if he was indeed born in that city.

All records are in the city of birth. You don't write to the Province but to the comune...so start with Pavia. Here is a link to help with letters in Italian: http://www.anzwers.org/free/italiangen/ ... tters.html
It also has additional info about the records. You will write to what we would call the town clerk's office....the official in charge of records:

Ufficio di Stato Civile
Comune di Pavia(PC)
27100 Pavia
Italia

List the name both ways, first-last, last-first since this is an issue. And give the date of birth you have...indicate he is adopted. And then see what they find.

Good Luck
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Re: Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of

Post by suanj »

I believe that the draft registration card is about a Ignazio CARRINELLO/CARINELLO born in 1882 and coming from Marsala... emigrated in the 1910....just a suggestion, regards, suanj
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Re: Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of

Post by Biff83 »

suanj wrote:I believe that the draft registration card is about a Ignazio CARRINELLO/CARINELLO born in 1882 and coming from Marsala... emigrated in the 1910....just a suggestion, regards, suanj
I have to respectfully disagree. In the upper left hand corner of the ship manifest, it states line 19, Ignazio Carrinello, not on board, and shows his destination as Beloit, Wisconsin. I believe the previously posted draft card for Carmeloni Ignazio is correct based on the street address which is the same as the address found on the census records, and on the name given as nearest relative.

Ignazio Carrinello 1910 Manifest

http://ellisisland.org/search/shipManif ... 0065%2ETIF
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Re: Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of

Post by suanj »

.... but this was the first destination on the ship's manifest and also Ignazio no travelled, crossed up, so we don't know the second further travel of Ignazio Carrinello and second final destination.. on draft card is wrote Carinello as surname, and is very readable.. CarmeloNI surname is very different in the handwriting, however anyone can to think what it want, I suggested my opinion.. regards, suanj
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Re: Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of

Post by Gina501 »

Thank you Suanj and Biff. But he could not have been on that ship in 1910. He was already married to Rosa Biani in Manhattan in April 1908. Also, the draft record says Carmillo and the 1910 passage says Cariniello. I believe that draft record is correct as I called my cousin last night and 314 104th street was his address.

But I appreciate all the help. I NEVER would have been able to do this without all of you. You have shown me more in 3 days than 3 months of searching!
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Re: Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of

Post by suanj »

Gina I'm convinced of my opinion and the surname in the draft registration card is Carrinello.. in the draft registration card on ancestry.com, it is possible some error abt the italian surnames, but this is different completely lacking "ni" final, however good luck... best regards, suanj
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Re: Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of

Post by Gina501 »

Yes, you could be right and the draft card might not be his. But he still couldn't have come to America in 1910. He was already married in 1908.
Gina
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Re: Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of

Post by suanj »

yes, sure, I believe that the ship's manifest that Biff83 found in 1905 is right.. and I ask my self because in the draft registration card no mentioned as nearest relatives the Rosa wife ...
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Re: Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of

Post by Gina501 »

nearest relative he listed as Biana. That was Rosa the wife's maiden name.
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Re: Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of

Post by Essgee »

Gina...

Went back and read all the posts again. I missed Varzi and concentrated on Pavia. The films from Varzi are also available at the Family History Library. So you can certainly see if Ignazio was born in that town.

Have a good day...
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Re: Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of

Post by Gina501 »

Riccardo has said that Varzi is in Pavia. Is this true?
Gina
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Re: Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of

Post by suanj »

Gina
I believe that the record is no right,
and Biana and the other word, after Biana....? what means?

for my experience, when a record is no perfectly sure, it means that are some error...

also in the past time, some similar case on this forum, and I was in the right...
so please to understand that my genealogy knowdlege.. it let me think, that on this topic are some error, and for first thing is a concept's error: because a record ONLY similar it could be incorrect...

but you can to ask equally the record in Italy .........

my suggestion is only for a help for right record search, but if you sure, very well and good luck...
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Re: Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of

Post by Gina501 »

I appreciate your knowledge suanj. I believe what you are saying. I have to hope that the draft record is correct because otherwise I do not have a birthdate for Carmeloni and I won't know how to find him in birth records. So I will start with the FEB 10 1882 birthdate and if I can't find him, I will continue on from there. But I will let you all know what I find when I find it. I just requested his death certificate from the City of New York. Hopefully that will tell me something when it comes in about 2 weeks.
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Re: Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of

Post by Gina501 »

Does anyone know if it mentions the cemetery on a New York City death certificate? As of right now, we do not even know where Carmeloni is burried.
Gina
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Re: Not a "brick wall" but the "GREAT WALL of

Post by nuccia »

You can try to place an inquiry at:

Find A Grave

The forum is pretty good..helped me locate my great grandfathers grave.
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