Naming Convention

[stfrancis]

My grandfather, Vincenzo (Louis) named who I thought is the first son, MIchael, b 1901, second son, Pasquale, b. 1911.

Vincenzo father was Pasquale, mother Celestina

My grandmother, Lilly, her father was Michael, mother Caterina...


is it possible there was another son, first born, named Pasquale who maybe died after Michael was born?

Also, Vincenzo & Lilly married in 1900, so would that first son most likely born in 1900 ?

[Tessa78]

My grandfather, Vincenzo (Louis) named who I thought is the first son, MIchael, b 1901, second son, Pasquale, b. 1911.

Vincenzo father was Pasquale, mother Celestina

My grandmother, Lilly, her father was Michael, mother Caterina...


is it possible there was another son, first born, named Pasquale who maybe died after Michael was born? Yes, Possible

Also, Vincenzo & Lilly married in 1900, so would that first son most likely born in 1900 ? Hard to tell. Some children were born after a church celebration of marriage, but before a civil registration of marriage. Could be 1900 or prior... Can we help you to search for a birth act?

T.

[carubia]

Or their first sons could've been twins, Pasquale and Michele, and Pasquale died before 1910. Have you seen the birth record of Michele from 1901?

[stfrancis]

All good ideas, thank you

I have Micheal baptism form Loretto church, Apr 1902, he was born Nov 1901. There is no health dept birth return that I can find, and he is not in the Manhattan birth indices, so no additional info can be had.

Louis and Lilly married civil, in Apr 1900. My searchs of a few churchs, Loretto, Transfiguration, Old ST Pats, and Most Precious Blood do not reveal a church ceremony, not yet ...more work to do...(they lived in Mott, Mulberry, Broome st area)

Unfortunately millions of docuemnts are not registered cause the church did not always submit returns to the government...

Pascal was born in 1911 in Canada.

Now im searching the DEath indices for Manhattan -1890 to 1910...and so far no deaths appear , but several spellings still need to be tried...

(Interesting point, i had thought church ceremony would come after civil registration..)

[carubia]

So they married in the US? In the US one would get a marriage license and then the church ceremony would be the actual marriage. If the signed license was returned to the city after the church ceremony then there would be a civil record as well.

In Italy, after 1865, civil marriage and church marriage were separate, and one could have one without the other or both in either order.

[stfrancis]

I have their "certificate", the marriage is recorded by the alderman.

The license does not appear in any index either. No other civil record. The license and affidavit for 1908 and LATER are now accessible, under the lawsuit by Reclaim The Records.

I also suspect no church ceremony either, more common than we think of.

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903 ... print=true